Einleitung
Viele Nutzer des BCG800XL SmartGrinders klagen über eine Blockierung oder Verstopfung und ein grausames Getriebestolpern, Klackergeräusch während des Betriebs. Das passiert üblicherweise wegen eines abgenutzten Flügelrads oder - weniger häufig - wegen eines abgenutzten Antriebsrades. Diese Anleitung zeigt, wie man dies überprüft und wie man das Flügelrad ersetzt, wenn es beschädigt ist.
Bitte schaue dir zuerst das folgende Video an, Breville Troubleshooting page um sicher zu gehen, dass ein Austausch des Flügelrads notwendig ist.
Breville verkauft unglücklicherweise keine Ersatzteile, daher ist diese Anleitung nur durch den Einsatz von 3D-Druck-Technologie möglich. Ich habe ein verbessertes Flügelrad entworfen für den BCG800XL und habe es hier veröffentlicht: Neues Flügelrad auf Shapeways
Hier gibt's einen kurzen Überblick über das Ersatzteil.
Diese Anleitung ist für das Modell BCG800. Wenn DU das Modell BCG600SIL oder BCG400SIL hast, dann gehe bitte zu dieser Anleitung.
ACHTUNG: Diese Anleitung gilt NICHT für die neuere BCG820XL, die ein verändertes Design hat und ein anderes Flügelrad nutzt.
Was du brauchst
Einführungsvideo
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Entferne den Trichter und das obere Mahlwerk. Entferne jeglichen gemahlenen Kaffee (Druckluftpistole oder Staubsauger) und schaue dir dann die Flügel des Flügelrads an.
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Wenn das Flügelrad durch die Öffnung passt (indem man es mit dem unteren Mahlwerk einfach herausnehmen kann), dann ist ein Austausch eindeutig notwendig.
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Ein gutes Flügelrad sollte nicht ohne weitere Zerlegung entnommen werden können und die Spitzen der Flügel sollten nicht sichtbar sein.
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Ich habe von dem Ersatzteil ein Modell erstellt und mehrere Male in der örtlichen Bibliothek ausgedruckt. Das finale Modell habe ich unter www.shapeways.com (Siehe Link im nächsten Punkt) zum selber Ausdrucken veröffentlicht. Wenn du dir die Zeit nehmen möchtest, kannst du natürlich auch eigenes Design modellieren.
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Hier ist ein Video mit Hintergrundinformationen zu dem Bauteil bei Shapeways.
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Du brauchst eine Rätsche mit 10mm Nuss oder einen 10mm Maulschlüssel.
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Einen mindestens 20cm langen Kreuzschlitzschraubendreher PH2, vorzugsweise mit magnetischer Spitze.
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Sandpapier und Feile sind nur notwendig, wenn das gedruckte Flügelrad nicht vor vornherein passt.
Where in the heck do I find a screwdriver like that?? I went to Lowe's and all they have are #2 gauge regular screwdrivers and I need a #1 gauge. Plus, is yours magnetically tipped? Did you lose the screws in there once you removed them?
I'm not the handiest person, so I'm having difficulty with those screws in particular.
Thanks!
Amazon has it. It's a #2 and just needs to be longer than 12 inches. Just touch it to a magnet if you want to magnetize it. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0037G...
I previously stated based on a rough guess that the minimum screwdriver length was 12 inches. After recent disassembly and measurement, it is clear that 8 inches of length (not including the handle) is actually enough.
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Entferne den Einfülltrichter und das obere Mahlwerk.
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Benutze das 10mm Werkzeug, um die Mutter des unteren Mahlwerks zu lösen.
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Drehe den Knopf für den Mahlgrad auf die feinste Einstellung.
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Merke dir die Reihenfolge, in der du die Unterlegscheiben entfernt hast, um sie später wieder richtig zusammensetzen zu können.
Does anyone respond to these comments. I’m already stuck on step #1. I am unable to release the upper ring gear. The video makes it look so easy, however I am twisting with all my might & it wont pop off. Do I try to pop it off with a screw driver & hammer?
It can be damned tight...vacuum out any coffee dust, turn it upside down, give the machine /grinder a hard tap, then vacuum again...you might also try a few drops of water around, and at the bottom, of the ring
There was only a single washer for me at this stage. I was very careful about this. After reassembly everything worked fine. So if you only find one washer it may not be you.
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Wickle das Stromkabel ab und löse die 4 Schrauben in der Grundplatte.
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Entferne die 4 Gummifüße.
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Führe das Stromkabel durch das Loch in der Grundplatte, während du diese vom restlichen Gehäuse abnimmst.
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Verwende den langen Kreuzschlitzschraubendreher PH2, um die 4 Schrauben zu entfernen, mit denen die Oberseite befestigt ist.
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Drehe die Kaffeemühle um und hebe die Oberseite langsam ab.
i unscrewed the 4 screws but couldn’t remove the top it’s so attached! I’ve sage dose control pro..
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Entferne die beiden Schrauben von der Oberseite des Displays.
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Hebe das Display nach oben und aus dem Rahmen heraus.
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Stelle sicher, dass der Knopf für den Mahlgrad auf die feinste Einstellung gedreht ist.
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Nutze einen wasserfesten Stift, um eine Markierung auf allen 3 Teilen des Zahnradgetriebes zu setzen. Die gesetzten Linien müssen beim Zusammenbau später wieder zusammen passen.
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Es gibt 4 Kunststoffhalterungen für das große, weiße Zahnrad. Ich habe mit den Fingerspitzen beider Händen unter den Rand des großen Zahnrads gegriffen und gerade nach oben gezogen, um es zu entfernen.
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Wenn gerade Hochziehen nicht funktioniert, versuche eine Seite mit den Fingern leicht hoch zu hebeln, bis sie sich bewegt. Wiederhole es auf der anderen Seite.
Really frustrated. Had to go buy a 12 inch philips screwdriver to get this far but the white wheel will not budge with considerable upward pressure - feels like something else needs to be loosened.
The white gear as well as the grey plastic cylindrical part inside of it, come off as a single piece. If pulling straight up isn't working, try curling your fingers under just one side of the white gear, and prying upwards until that side pops free a little. Then do the other side. On the BCG800XL it is held on by 4 grey plastic snaps, placed radially every 90 degrees. Here's an example of the type of snap joint: https://patentimages.storage.googleapis....
Help! What to do if alignment gets off? Have marked spots as shown, the gear assembly on/off in correct spot, but when putting back together only get a small option of grind choice. The grind dial on right has no stopping point to make sure in fine grind position when apart. Missing some component here now.
Hi Diane, watch the video here: https://youtu.be/1lL8BInrki8?t=15m41s It sounds like the screws on your large gear ended up south of the 'plastic stop' referred to in the video. Watch this part too, to get a feel for how the mechanism works: https://youtu.be/1lL8BInrki8?t=10m15s The pics in Step #12 further down also illustrates this better.
My big gear isn’t popping off or even feeling like it’s going to budge. It’s gray/black on mine. I’m wondering if they changed the design and so the way it comes apart. Please help if able.
Double check that it's a BCG800XL Smart Grinder. I've never heard of it differing from the pictures and your description almost sounds like it's the BCG600 or BCG400, which have a different teardown procedure (on a different ifixit page).
Has anyone experienced the bottom smaller nylon drive gear stripping teeth where the motor worm drive gear shaft mates with the nylon gear?
That does happen sometimes, usually if a rock gets in the beans and then jams the burrs suddenly. Thankfully there is a source for the gear. See Step 21 - Troubleshooting #3 further down.
Check your model here. Breville has upgraded the grinder to the BCG820XL which uses a different assembly up top. Getting this part off is tricky, but I have been able to do it.
1. Take the two screws off the small white gear which will allow you to lift the white gear out of the way - this is how the digital readout measures the grinder. Do not touch this, else you will mess up the grind readout.
2. Remove the two screws in the large black plastic gear.
3. While holding the inner smooth plastic ring in the center of the large gear, turn the grind control knob until this piece of plastic lifts out.
4. Pull out bad impeller and replace. The shapeways BCG800XL model does not fit and I have been unable to locate another one. Going to work on printing a new one in my free time.
5. Work backwards to put back together.
Were you able to print an impeller? I too have this same model.
Thanks,
How were you able to hold on to the smooth plastic ring? It keeps slipping between my fingers
took a _lot_ of pressure to lever the big white gear up. Like - I put the grinder body on the floor, put a towel to cushion the teeth of the gear and levered my fingers against the case. Maybe my grip was weak… . When I got it off, there was a bunch of coffee dust along the lip, so perhaps it was jammed on a bit tighter than it otherwise would have been. The extra image Ben provided was helpful in showing me what I was trying to pull off (I see it as a lip, not as “four tabs”, but maybe I’m missing something. Anyway - thanks.
I also had trouble lifting the big gear off. My solution was to locate one of the tabs mentioned above. I chose the one located 90 degrees to the right of the small encoder gear. I then applied upwards pressure beneath the large white gear, directly above the tab. This released the tab, and the rest of the gear lifted off easily.
I marked the big white gear, the small white gear, but I missed the bit about marking the grey threaded insert. Now I’m having a !&&* of a time getting it back on if it’s just slightly backed off of all the way tight. I tried one 360 degree turns and it popped on just fine but then the grind was basically press coarseness st what should have been espresso, so I assume the tighter fit is the right one. Can someone confirm? Should I send the top of the impeller so it snaps on? If I back off a bit from the marks and make the whole system turn together, I can snap it on, but when it gets tight it pops the gear off. Anyone have a suggestion?
I finally made it to changed the impeller but two tabs are broken ( you should add in your steps you can use a screwdriver to pry it off) I think it’s easier. Now my grinder isn’t jamming anymore. Thank you. I don’t know what I did wrong but now the grinder is giving me twice the coffee I have set ( for example If I set 1 shot, I received about the quantity of two shots of grind….and even if it’s set to the finest, the grind is to coarse. Any help to find a solution would be very appreciate. Thank you
Richard
There is a lot of potential here but I spent all day repeatedly taking apart an assembling. Electrostatic charge created by the 3D printed impeller is awful. Need to be made out of different plastic that is resistant to static. I even took out and washed as recommended.The impeller design is too aggressive and shoots the grounds out at almost mach speed and creates a huge mess. Also never could get the digital screen to have same calibration as before I took apart. Best just to send in to Breville and pay 120 dollars.
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Nimm das alte Flügelrad heraus und stelle sicher, dass die BEIDEN dünnen Unterlegscheiben darunter nicht herausfallen. Diese sind wichtig für die Gesamthöhe des unteren Mahlwerks und daher auch für die Einstellung des Mahlgrades.
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HINWEIS: Entsorge den feinfaserigen Filzring unter dem Flügelrad. Üblicherweise ist dieser in einem schlechten Zustand. Dieses Bauteil wird nicht mehr benötigt, weil das neue Flügelrad-Design wesentlich enger am Gehäuse anliegt und ziemlich effektiv Mahlgut vom Gehäuse und der Welle fern hält.
Hi Tim, I believe the stock washers are each 17.53mm outer diameter and about 10.2mm inner diameter. You could probably stray from there slightly to make it easier to find. Thickness is very very thin however and I unfortunately never measured. Rough guess is about 0.1 mm each, and there are two of them. FYI, if you want an easier route, this is my preferred trick for getting finer grinding: Störung an der BCG800XL Mühle wegen abgenutztem Flügelrad
I only had ONE washer, and it was .5mm thick. OD was 17.55mm and ID was 10.47
Also only had a single washer.
WARNING! Do not discard the felt ring! I did that, and had insane static electricity problems (we had to cup our hands around the grinder to keep coffee from flying everywhere). After a couple of years, and trying every home remedy for eliminating static (dipping the back of a spoon in water and stirring the beans, etc. etc.), it finally dawned on me that the wool felt might be providing a mechanism for dissipating the static electricity. I bought a replacement felt ring from Breville for $6 (https://www.breville.com/us/en/parts-acc...), installed it, and poof! no more static.
Side note; we've been using the new impeller daily for five years now, and it's still working great.
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Verwende Druckluft oder Zahnstocher, um den Auslaufschacht zu reinigen so lange er zugänglich ist, damit er frei von festgepresstem Kaffee ist.
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Spüle das neue Flügelrad mit Wasser und Seife ab. Tupfe es mit einem Handtuch trocken. Dies verhindert statische Aufladung beim ersten Mahlen.
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Es ist wichtig, dass das Ersatzteil aus dem 3D-Druck ordentlich passt. Die Toleranzen des Bauteils sind eher im Plus-Bereich.
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Überprüfe, ob die Stifte des konischen Mahlwerk-Flügelrads gut in die Aufnahmelöcher passen. Wenn es zu eng sein sollte, schmirgele das Flügelrad etwas mit dem Sandpapier, damit wird es passend gemacht.
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Schmirgele nicht die geraden Seitenflanken der Wellenbohrung. Wenn notwendig, schmirgele nur die abgerundeten Enden der Bohrung. Die Seitenflanken nehmen den größten Anteil der Belastung der Antriebswelle auf.
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Der Spalt an dieser Stelle sollte mit dem neuen Bauteil sehr schmal sein. Wenn es zu eng ist, kannst Du die Spitzen leicht abschmirgeln.
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Hier ist ein Video der Montage mit dem gedruckten Bauteil von Shapeways.
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Überprüfe vor dem endgültigen Zusammenbau, ob das konische untere Mahlwerk und das Flügelrad mit den beiden Unterlegscheiben darunter gut auf die Antriebswelle passen. Stelle sicher, dass alle aufgeführten Bauteile vorhanden sind.
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Die Oberkante der Antriebswelle sollte ca. 0,5 mm tiefer sitzen als die Oberfläche des unteren Mahlwerks. Wenn die Mutter angezogen wird, werden beide Bauteile eben sein.
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Wenn das Mahlwerk zu weit über der Oberkante der Antriebswelle liegt (höher als in der Skizze), versuche die Hutmutter und die Unterlegscheiben aufzusetzen (siehe Nummer 7, 8 und 9 in der Skizze), fest anzuziehen, und dann wieder abzunehmen.
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Wenn das untere Mahlwerk immer noch zu hoch auf der Antriebswelle sitzt, mache einen kleinen Abstecher zu Schritt 20 und komme dann wieder hierher zurück.
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Setze das Getriebe mit den folgenden Bauteilen sorgfältig wieder zusammen:
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Vermeide es, diese Bauteile zu verdrehen, um die Ausrichtung beizubehalten.
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Wenn du das Getriebe wieder einsetzt, stelle sicher, dass die beiden Anschlagschrauben auf der linken Seite des schwarzen Kunststoff-Anschlags sind.
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Richte die große Lasche an dem breiten Schlitz aus.
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Richte die kleine Lasche an dem schmalen Schlitz aus.
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Einmal zusammengesetzt, drehe den Mahlstärkeknopf von ganz fein bis ganz grob, um sicher zu stellen, dass alles funktioniert.
Will this impeller work for a BES860? Do you have a 3D print for that?
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Fortgeschrittener Tuning-Tipp: Wenn du mehr Kontrolle über den Mahlgrad haben möchtest, kannst du die beiden Anschlagschrauben in dem großen weißen Zahnrad auf dem Foto entfernen. Du wirst den Mahlgrad dann weit über die normale Bandreite hinaus einstellen können.
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Setze das Display zurück in seinem Rahmen und befestige es mit den zwei dazugehörigen Schrauben.
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Setze das konische untere Mahlwerk zurück und stelle sicher, dass es ordentlich auf die beiden Stifte des neuen Flügelrades passt.
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Setze die Unterlegscheiben ein und behalte die ursprüngliche Reihenfolge bei. Z.B.: flache Unterlegscheibe nach unten, geschlitzte Unterlegscheibe nach oben.
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Ziehe die 10mm Hutmutter mit Linksgewinde fest.
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Überprüfe den Knopf für den Mahlgrad, ob beide Endpositionen erreicht werden.
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Setze die Kunststoffabdeckung wieder auf.
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Drehe die Mühle um und verwende den langen Kreuzschlitzschraubendreher PH2, um die 4 Schrauben wieder zu montieren, mit denen der Deckel befestigt ist.
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Setze die vier Gummifüße wieder ein.
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Schraube die vier Basisschrauben wieder ein.
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Wickle das Kabel wieder ein.
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Setze das obere Mahlwerk und den Einfülltrichter (noch ohne Kaffeebohnen) wieder ein.
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Lass die (leere) Kaffeemühle kurz laufen um sicher zu stellen, dass alles ordnungsgemäß läuft. Probiere beide Einstellungen, fein und grob.
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Wenn soweit alles gut aussieht, gib ein paar Kaffeebohnen in den Einfülltrichter. Schau Dir das Mahlgut an und probiere es aus! Wenn irgendetwas nicht funktioniert hat, schaue dir die Problemlösungen unten an oder schau dir die Problemlösungsseite hier an.
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Mit dem neuen Flügelrad gibt es eine Einlaufzeit von ca. einer Woche, in der das Flügelrad eine schützende Kaffeeschicht bekommt. Es wird eine leichte oder mittlere Röstung während dieser Zeit empfohlen.
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Herzlichen Glückwunsch, dass du ein Produkt aus einem 3D-Drucker für deine Reparatur verwendet hast! Genieße deinen Kaffee! Viel Glück!
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Wenn gemahlener Kaffee über die Auslaufrutsche hinaus rutscht, könnte der Kaffee zu trocken sein, die Feuchtigkeit ist zu gering (statische Aufladung) oder dass der Auslauftrichter zu glatt ist.
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Um das zu beheben, kannst du mit ein wenig Speiseöl auf deinem Finger die Fläche des Auslauftrichters einreiben. Eine dünne Schicht gemahlenen Kaffees wird daran haften bleiben.
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Die erhöhte Reibung des Mahlgutes auf dem Auslauftrichter wird die Ausgabegeschwindigkeit ausreichend verringern, so dass ein Überlauf vermieden wird.
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Für Schwierigkeiten mit statischer Aufladung, schau hier.
I am afraid I have the static electricity problem as the oil trick did not help much. The ground coffee not only speeds up, but it goes up in the air and sticks to the machine (on the metal piece around the chute) and spills around the grinder pretty bad. The former impeller has never suffered the static problem. Could it be that the metal insert inside the original part sort of "grounds" the impeller to the machine? Honestly this is a major drawback as cleaning the countertop every time is annoying, to say the least. I use fresh roasted beans from a coffee shop so I doubt the beans are the problem. The problem seems to worsen over the grinding, at first the ground coffee will drop in the portafilter all right, but the more you grind the more static appears to be generated and the spraying starts, to get worst at the end. Too bad cause the whole process (apart from Breville putting screws in a deep and cavernous cave) was very straightforward and I was very excited to fix a product with a printed part.
Hi Vincent! Interesting. I can vouch that the problem can be fixed. Usually the oil does the trick, however there may be some factor that isn't understood yet. I roast my own beans, and when I first installed the ShapeWays impeller static was indeed a problem. Then, after a few days of use, the problem went away and never returned. This, along with some feedback from others, led to the oil trick discovery which seems to have helped most folks. There must be some other factor in your case. If it keeps up, or if you find any other "knobs to turn" in your experimenting, report back and I'm happy to investigate further down the rabbit hole with you. Perhaps it's something like a rather dry roast in combination with low humidity weather.
Maybe as the impeller itself gets coated with coffee bean oils it stops generating as much static charge. I'm curious, if you grind some really oily beans, does the problem go away? Then, does it stay gone when returning to dry beans? Might be a good experiment.
Thanks for getting back to me. I did add oil deep in the hole, it seemed to diminish the problem but did not stop it. I could try oilier beans, I usually drink black / heavily roasted beans and this could be an explanation. I'll let you know if the problem solves itself along the way, I'll give the fix time to set in :-).
Tried a few different beans with no success. I added more oil in despair, it clogged and the keyway on the impeller stripped. Grinder is useless again after MUCH trouble. Too bad I was super stocked I could fix it. Apparently the metal insert in the original impeller was no decoration...
I'm bummed too Vincent. I was rooting for you and I'm really sorry to hear that the issue didn't resolve. This is the first I've learned of an impeller keyway failing too. I wonder if too much oil, rather than just a fine coating, made the grounds clump together into a paste causing significant resistance. I would expect it to take significant back pressure to damage the keyway. :-(
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NOTE to any others: Hindsight is 20/20 they say, but future users should stick to just oiling the chute and not the chamber. The oil in the chute fixes overspray well, but static electricity it seems is still a mystery. It makes sense why the plastic of the impeller, rubbing against coffee grounds could generate a charge. What is unclear, is why it only affects some units and what change results in it going away. If anyone finds a fix, please post to let us know.
By the way Vincent, if you are open to trying again, the next impeller is "on the house" courtesy of SteadyMouse, LLC. Send me an email at coffeegrinderhelp[at]steadymouse[dot]com if you are interested.
I just switched out my impeller today for the shape ways one, and immediately got this problem, going to try the oil trick, luckily for me I have some old bad beans I can afford to just run through the grinder but I want to make sure I do the right thing when I try and fix. When you say oil the chute that just means the part where they grinds are actually falling out of the grinder, not the passage that the impeller pushes the grounds through, right?
Yes, we've learned through some unfortunate trial and error (See above) not to oil the chamber with the impeller. Let that part get coated by coffee naturally. A small dab of oil applied to the chute where the grinds fall out is all that is necessary to stop overspray. Static charge is a separate issue still being investigated.
I am also experiencing the static issue. Applying oil helped for about half of the first grind with it applied. I would be very interested in any new findings, as I've been dealing with this for months.
It's still not well understood. There must be some variables that make the problem appear only for some. Jump over to the old Amazon reviews of the BCG800XL at this link here and search 'static':
https://www.amazon.com/Breville-BCG800XL...
You will see many comments mentioning static charge. Some folks comment that there's hardly any. Others comment that there's way too much, especially when grinding into the plastic cup. In light of this, I think there are multiple factors at play, and some are intrinsic to Breville's design. The impeller may influence static levels, however it's only part of the equation. Steps 22 and 23 of the ifixit article offer a few more ideas to try.
My own grinder with the impeller, has hardly any static cling at all and grinds into the portafilter well.
This is an espresso grind nearly every time and I roast my own stuff to a medium level. One day though I tried a very very dark oily roast (Starbucks Columbia IIRC) and the static cling problem did happen! It was so bad that grounds stuck to the outside of the unit. That seems like a strong clue, although I still don't understand it well. So, in Step 19 I recommend a film of oil on the chute to reduce centrifugal momentum, and yet in Step 23 I recommend not using oily ultra dark roasts.
Lastly, grinding into the plastic cup seems to have static issues for everyone. I recommend switching to a glass or metal cup for coarser grinds.
I have tried everything the static is still happen. Did not have the problem ever with the original impeller. Any other solutions?? Frustrating.
Hi Gus, I have begun to realize static is a common issue with many grinders, however it is also clear that the plastic impeller can exacerbate the problem. In my own case the static issue went away on its own and only returned once, when I switched to set of ultra dark beans I received as a gift. '''A few weeks ago I ran across this tip here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0Dh1W40...
It leads me to think some beans have more moisture than others, and there must be a certain threshold —below which, static charge explodes. Try the tip with the spoon in that video and see if it resolves the issue for you.
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Zu nah (beispielsweise wird das Pulver zu fein): Wenn die Mahlzähne zu nah einander sind oder sich sogar berühren (obwohl sie zentriert sind), dann ist die Schaube auf dem unteren Mahlwerk vielleicht nicht fest genug angezogen. Mit einer Ratsche und einer 10 mm Nuss kannst du die Schraube nochmal fest gegen den Uhrzeigersinn ziehen.
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Wenn das nicht klappt, sieh dir das zweite Foto an, um sicherzustellen, dass das untere Mahlwerk auf der richtigen Höhe ist.
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Wenn klar ist, dass das untere Mahlwerk zu hoch ist, kannst du den rot eingefärbten Bereich am Flügelrad im dritten Bild abschmirgeln. Probiere zwischendurch immer wieder, bis die Höhe dem zweiten Bild entspricht. Achte darauf, nicht zu viel abzuschmirgeln, es ist schwer, das rückgängig zu machen.
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Zu weit entfernt: Wenn die Mahlwerke zu weit voneinander entfernt sind, und das Mahlgut nicht fein genug wird, hast du vielleicht eine Unterlegscheibe unter dem Flügelrad vergessen. Siehe Schritt 9. Zusätzlich kannst du eine der beiden Unterlegscheiben über dem unteren Mahlwerk rausnehmen und die Schraube nicht ganz so fest drehen.
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Breville verschickt auch passende Unterlegscheiben, wenn man ihnen schreibt.
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Zuletzt können beide Probleme auch auftauchen, wenn die Anordnung in Schritt 12 sich verändert. Wenn das der Fall ist, musst du wohl das obere Mahlwerk nochmal abbauen und einstellen. Das ist schwer, aber machbar. Ich empfehle, sich die alte Anordnung zu markieren.
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Wenn es sich im Betrieb grausam anhört (auch ohne Bohnen) wie hier: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcQcbHIP..., dann ist es möglicherweise ein beschädigter Drehmomentbegrenzer oder ein abgenutztes Antriebszahnrad. ZUR INFO: Die Situation im Video ist das Ergebnis eines Steinchens, das im Mahlwerk steckengeblieben ist.
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Ich beschreibe jetzt nicht den kompletten Vorgang, um das Gerät zu zerlegen. Ich arbeite mich bis zum Schritt 9 vor. Im Bild sind 4 Schrauben mit Unterlegscheiben und 2 Schrauben auf dem Sensor zu sehen. Wenn diese gelöst werden, bist du auf dem besten Weg, das Getriebegehäuse näher untersuchen zu können.
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Die Reparaturmöglichkeiten sind noch nicht so gut ausgelotet, wenn du also eine Beschädigung feststellst und erfolgreich reparieren kannst, schreibe unten einen Kommentar dazu. ZUR INFO: Breville hat einen Reparaturservice für rund 90$ und das wird in dieser Situation wahrscheinlich die beste Lösung sein.
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Der Drehmomentbegrenzer könnte zu reparieren sein, indem man die beiden Federn ca. 2mm auseinander zieht. Das sollte den Drehmoment erhöhen, ab dem er anfängt, durchzurutschen.
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Für das rechte Antriebszahnrad gibt es eine Bezugsquelle, die von einem User gefunden wurde (vielen Dank an Dave Gordon!): Es konnte noch nicht bestätigt werden, dass es wirklich funktioniert, aber der Preis ist ziemlich günstig, wenn du es also ausprobierst und es funktioniert, hinterlasse unten einen Kommentar für uns!
Just bumbled my way through this repair including the forumappliances replacemnt gear, and a video would help a great deal. Removing the whole motor assembly is challenging as the wires are short and permanently connected. Patience and a steady hand are needed. A guide to reassembling the torque release gear would have helped a lot. But once you swap out the damaged gear and reassemble everything, it works like new. Hope it lasts long enough to save up for a Mazzer.
Nice work! Yes, I consider changing out the gear to be "hard mode". The replacement gear is unfortunately so hard to come by, and not robust when 3D printed, that I haven't attempted a write-up yet. Glad you got everything back in ship-shape however, and can enjoy your coffee!
wow. so I am in to Shapeways for $28 for the new impeller, and $15 for a monster long screwdriver. the impeller was in rough shape and would have needed to be replaced. that is all good now. However the nasty sound is still there. Thinking a rock (and I know there was one at one point) was the culprit. I am assuming that a gear is stripped. Please help if you can! You can DM me at jaynalbach@gmail.com I can’t imagine paying Breville anything after all this time and investment, so i gotta finish this up. caffeine deprived! cheers Jay
Oh no, not the gear-box too! That’s terrible luck. Well, two paths: You can either cut your losses and request a refund from ShapeWays or tear down to the gearbox if you are a brave soul. If the gear is stripped, the forumappliances link above sometimes has it in stock. If the gears are good, you can likely just tighten the nut hard on the torque limiter (left side of the pic). I’ll email this to you as well.
OK. I went in deep. I dismantled the entire gearbox, and found 2 interesting issues. 1) the main drive gear is roached. At least 6-7 of the teeth are mashed /sheared off or flattened. This must have been a result of the rock that got in. It created a sizable flat spot which I am certain is the additional issue. The extra part listed on Forum Appliances just came in stock, so I ordered the part. Hopefully it will be in the mail to me tomorrow and we can look forward to reassembly shortly thereafter. 2) Another thing i thought was interesting, is that one of the tension springs (6 in total in conjunction with 6 ball bearings) was loose in the gear box when I opened it up. I will certainly give it a shot to pull out the springs a bit to add some tension, but that bit will be tricky to re-assemble for sure. Ben, if you’re up for it, I may ask a few questions. I did find a loose washer (very small) which I think goes on the end of the torque limiter, but may need clarity. Cheers Jay
Sounds like a good plan Jay. I will be here.
I did open it here Breville 860 Grinder Teardown
ordered the impeller, swapped it out but it didnt fix the issue, so i ripped it down to the gears, and found that the gears teeth are smashed. Where can i get replacement gears? link above shows ‘page not found’ help?
Oh no. We used to have a good soure for that gear over at forumappliances.com but they no longer carry it. Ebay has it if you search “Breville main gear”. Unfortunately it is way overpriced in my opinion. You could try contacting the seller to see if they will come down. Might be cheaper to buy another broken BCG800XL on ebay and salvage a gear out of it (as long as it too does not have the same issue).
Looks like main gear for breville is available on ebay now as link provided now goes to 404
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Gelegentlich berichten Nutzer von statisch aufgeladenem Mahlgut, dass den Gesetzen der Schwerkraft zu trotzen scheint. Es schwebt in der Luft und haftet sich an alles mögliche und hinterlässt so eine Sauerei!
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Häufig erledigt sich das von selbst, wenn das Flügelrad einige Tage in Betrieb gewesen ist. Es bleibt dennoch ein Mysterium, ich glaube, dass das eher in trockenen Klimazonen auftritt, kombiniert mit bestimmten Kaffeebohnensorten im Zusammenspiel mit dem neuen Flügelrad.
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Um das zu beheben, schrubbe das Flügelrad mit einem Schwamm oder einer Bürste, spüle es ab und tupfe es mit einem Handtuch ab, bis es wieder trocken ist.
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Das bisschen Feuchtigkeit scheint die statische Aufladung dauerhaft zu beseitigen. Ich vermute, dass das Phänomen auftritt, bis das Flügelrad von selbst eine Kaffeeschicht erhält und somit statische Aufladung verhindert.
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Siehe auch hier.
I have the static problem big time. It would have been helpful to go into this more in the main assembly instructions. Even though I washed the new impeller with water (not soap, since that wasn't mentioned) and dried as suggested, I'm still getting a LOT of static and the grounds are flying everywhere. If it had mentioned washing well with soap, I would have done it. I am not in the mood to take it apart now and wash, so I'll just have to wait awhile and see if it fixes itself. I live in southern California, and am using a Trader Joe's French Roast, so maybe that is the problem.
Water should be enough. The other possibility is it's the roast. Is it really dark/oily? I do my own roasting and never have a problem with those beans. Just this last month though, I didn't have time and used a charcoal dark starbucks roast I had gotten as a gift. The stuff ground all clumpy and was getting everywhere. There's definitely some mystery going on with certain beans. Troubleshooting #5 is my best attempt to help folks there (based on the starbucks experience), however there's plenty of room for discovery yet.
I have tried everything the static is still happen. Did not have the problem ever with the original impeller. Any other solutions?? Frustrating.
Hi Gus, I recently ran across this solution here that seems easy enough to try: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0Dh1W40...
Before this replacement impeller i never had issues with static coffee. After washing with soap not solved still. Tried the water hack also not working. Used several sorts of beans and no solution whatsoever. What to do…
Considering to bin this garbage grinder :/
Did you throw the felt ring away (per the instructions)? If so, that might be your problem. I did that, and had insane static (we had to cup our hands around the grinder to keep coffee from flying everywhere). After a couple of years, and trying every home remedy for eliminating static (dipping the back of a spoon in water and stirring the beans, etc. etc.), it finally dawned on me that the wool felt might be providing a mechanism for dissipating the static electricity. I bought a replacement felt ring from Breville for $6 (https://www.breville.com/us/en/parts-acc...), installed it, and poof! no more static.
Side note; we've been using the new impeller daily for five years now, and it's still working great.
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Manche Bohnensorten, besonders die Sorte "so stark geröstet, ich bin fast Kohle" könnten zu ölig sein. Diese Eigenschaft führt dazu, dass der Kaffee nicht zu Pulver sondern zu einer "Paste" verarbeitet wird. Das ist natürlich schlecht, weil es dann in Klumpen oder gar nicht ausgeworfen wird.
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Verklumptes Mahlgut führt häufig dazu, dass der Siebträger überlauft und eine Sauerei hinterlässt. Ich vermute, da die größeren Pulverpartikel ein höheres Gewicht und auch eine größere Masse haben, dass diese mit mehr Schwung aus der Ausgaberutsche herauskommen.
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Wenn du das obere Mahlwerk entnimmst und auf dem Flügelrad eine schöne gleichmäßige schwarze Oberfläche zu sehen ist, dann ist das ein Hinweis auf dieses Problem.
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Die Lösung: Säubere die untere Kammer oder löse zumindest die verklumpten Kaffeereste und wechsle auf eine andere Kaffeesorte.
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Diese Schritte sollten dich komplett bis zum Wiederzusammenbau geführt haben. Angenommen, das Flügelrad war die Ursache, wird nun alles wieder funktionieren. Wenn du weitere Probleme hast, schau dir die Tipps zur Problembehebung an oder schreibe einen Kommentar für weitere Hilfe.
Diese Schritte sollten dich komplett bis zum Wiederzusammenbau geführt haben. Angenommen, das Flügelrad war die Ursache, wird nun alles wieder funktionieren. Wenn du weitere Probleme hast, schau dir die Tipps zur Problembehebung an oder schreibe einen Kommentar für weitere Hilfe.
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Besonderer Dank geht an diese Übersetzer:innen:
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Diese Übersetzer:innen helfen uns, die Welt zu reparieren! Wie kann ich mithelfen?
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258 Kommentare
Thanks Joe! I had a lot of fun making it. Cheers to you too.
hi! thank you so much for this guide! I purchased the 3d printed impeller from shape ways and it fit beautifully! I'm still having issues with the grinder though- it will now grind through once at whatever volume I have it set at, but then when you try to grind again, it makes a high pitched sound similar to the one it makes when out of beans. If you disassemble and reassemble the burrs, it will do the same thing again- grind through one cycle then stop. Any ideas???
Hi Patrick,
I wonder if there is a problem with the hopper. When you remove the hopper after the problem you're seeing happens, there should be at least a tablespoon worth of beans on top of the burrs waiting to be ground. If this is not the case, then I suspect it's the hopper not letting beans get through. You can test your hopper by holding it over a bowl and twisting the locking/unlocking knob. The beans within should flow through freely into the bowl. If this is OK, then next, perhaps make sure it's locking into place properly on the grinder. Something could be getting in the way of the locking mechanism.
Any chance you could share the STL file on Thingiverse.com or something similar? I've got my own 3D printer and would love to give this a whirl.
Sorry friend. I haven't even made back enough to cover the CPA that I'm gonna have to hire just to help me navigate the maze of tax implications from selling an item on shapeways. I'll consider it after I break even OK.
For anyone not trying to buy the $25 part, here’s the STL link and cheaper option:
Hi Ben, do you have any idea if this impeller would fit BCG800 model?
Thank you,
Yulia
Hi Yulia,
I'm pretty sure BCG800 and BCG800XL are the same thing. In my googling, I'm unable to find a difference. FYI: If it looks like the first pic in step #1 above then it's almost certainly going to fit.
Take care,
--Ben
I have the same problem with the grinder in my Barista Express. We complained and had a brand new machine... same problem. With som beans it goes nuts. Do you think I could use the same part in the grinder on the Barista Express?
This may take some investigating. Breville does sometimes use the same parts in different models. If you remove the upper and lower burrs, does the impeller look just like the one in the pic in Step #9 above? The hole for the shaft should be 10mm by 8mm diameter and the entire impeller should be between 38mm and 44mm across from edge to edge depending on wear. If all that matches up, there's a high probability it's the same.
First of all, thanks to Ben for this amazing DIY solution. Truly inspirational. I am going to try this out on the grinder in my Barista Express BES860XL. I suspect the part will fit with minor modifications based on the pictures above and my measurements (41.4mm, 45mm opening), so I ordered it from Shapeways. One difference is that the impeller shaft hole on the BES860XL part is full-round 10mm diameter, not slotted, so I will have to drill out the hole. Grinder disassembly is slightly different on the BES860XL than above. For example, there is no acorn nut attaching the conical burr to the impeller shaft from the top; it appears to be threaded on. Thus the only way to remove the impeller is to take off the torque limiter (yes, Ben was right about that; see picture in step 21). You'll need to grab the conical burr with a vise grip, lined with something grippy but softer than the steel burr, and be careful not to lose the ball bearings and springs in the slip clutch :) I'll let you know if it all works out.
ybergner -
Stuff like this makes my day. Good luck sir!
Update: part arrived today. In short: it is working in the BES860XL!! Full story: Surface was rougher than I expected, having opted for polishing, but I really have no idea how rough it would have been.... I knew that I would be drilling out the shaft hole, which I did, but I also checked for other compatibility issues with the BES860XL. Comparing the underside of the new impeller to the old one, I noticed that the inner diameters (where the fibrous felt washer sits) were different--my original was 24.7mm--but I didn't think this would matter since I did not need to re-use the felt washer. Overall fit inside the grinder well was a bit tight, as promised, so I filed it down to spin free. That's all it took; I reassembled the grinder. Ta-dah! Deliciousness restored. (One thing, maybe this will pass, is that the grinds definitely have more electrostatic charge upon exit. You can see them spread/stick in the container. I wonder if this is related to the type of plastic or just the tighter tolerances/rubbing.)
ybergner -
You did it! That's really cool that it works in the BES860. This will help a few others, I'm sure. For the static charge issue, try "Step 19 - Troubleshooting Overspray" up above. It's a 3 minute fix on the BCG800XL. Perhaps it will work for you too. Thanks for posting all the cool details! Have a good one!
Thanks so much for this guide, you saved my BCG800!!! I installed my new 3d printed impeller at the weekend and my grinder is now doing what it should...grinding beans! The guide was really easy to follow. The one thing I'm not totally happy with is the fineness of the grind. Rather than following your advanced modding tip I have have ordered shims from Breville who send these out for free (I'm in Australia not sure if they ship them elsewhere). Thanks again, this has really opened up my eyes to 3D printing, nothing like having something in your hands to appreciate it, cheers.
Hi Martin,
Your note made my evening! Glad I could help. The shim kit sounds like a good option, especially if it's free. I think these grinders are capable of going very fine when folks put in that little extra tuning effort! Enjoy your coffee and welcome to the world of 3D printing!
Cheers,
--Ben
I installed the printed impeller and it fit well. My grinder was still making the loud ratcheting noise and would stop grinding (and just spin) with any beans with the new impeller. It was pretty obvious from its behavior that the torque limiter was at fault. Since I was in this deep and it's a thrift store grinder I decided to dive in - there's a torque limiter in the gearbox that consists of springs and ball bearings under one of the gears (the final driven gear). The main gear was in perfect shape. Eliminating the torque limiter means either epoxying a small metal plate to the nylon gear or, plan B, using some pins. There is insufficient clearance to screw or bolt them together. I'm working on the pin option since bonding nylon to metal is difficult. Like Ben said if you remove the torque limiter its safety function is no longer there. I think removing it is achievable, will post when I have a solution. Thanks to Ben for getting us all this far, it's a great impeller.
Best of luck Joseph. There's another lady who got stuck here also (She contributed the video in the "Troubleshooting #3" step). Whatever you find may help her too. If you figure it out, I'm happy to integrate it into the guide. Thanks for going further down the rabbit hole for us.
I received your impeller and attempted install today. Couldn't get past step 6 b/c I don't have a long enough phillips screwdriver. Actually, I have several that are long enough but not thin enough to fit in the hole. I even tried my precision tool set and they were too large for the hole. Where do you recommend getting one? Lowes and Ace locally didn't have anything close.
Wow, I would have thought Ace would have something. Any Phillips #2 screwdriver longer than 12 inches is fine. Amazon has one here if you don't mind the extra wait: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0037G...
That screwdriver is huge. My suggestion is to go for something a bit less long, like this 12 incher: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B012T3...
FYI, after recent disassembly and direct measurement, it is clear that 8 inches of shaft length on the Phillips #2 screwdriver is actually enough. This should be easier to find than 12".
i had to search and search for the right screwdriver. In the end, I bought a WIHA SoftFinish® Phillips Driver #1 x 300mm and it does the trick! not cheap by any means, but I am sure i will find other uses for this beauty. Their site is under construction, but the shop is called W.C Winks Hardware, in Portland Oregon. Its one of the sexiest tool shops I’ve ever been to. Now to get this damned grinder to start working again! Looks like I have a gearbox problem.
FWIW:
I bought this screwdriver and the size of the "X" is way too big a fit for the screws: Amartisan 2-Piece 12'' long Screwdriver Set, Long Blade Screwdriver Set 12-Inch Magnetic Screwdriver, Phillips & Slotted Bits.
Still trying to find the best magnetic long shaft screwdriver for this!
I've been to Ace, Home Depot and Lowes and no luck. They have precision kits but way too short. My issue was not only the length, but also the diameter. A regular screw driver shaft wouldn't fit even if long enough. It has to be long with a very small diameter like a precision tool. Weird. I thought for sure I would see other comments here from people having the same issue but guess it is just me. The tool you noted on Amazon was the one I nearly purchased yesterday so I will give it a try. My grinder will put out a courser grind, just has trouble as I move towards the finer grinds so I can wait on the tool via mail. Thanks for your help and for making the replacement impeller to begin with. Much appreciated.
The grind from my Breville BCG800 (not the 800XL) had become inconsistent and clumpy lately - to the point where I couldn't make good espresso any more.
After seeing this page I checked the impeller in my machine. It was clear the impeller had worn away - it's edges were several mm from the side.
I ordered the 3D printed impeller from Shapeways and installed it yesterday.
The 3D printed impeller fitted perfectly. My BCG800 did not have a steel washer underneath the impeller, but did have the fibrous felt washer, which I did not re-install.
When re-assembled, the burr appeared to be seated slightly higher on the spindle, but when tested, it worked perfectly with no apparent change to the grind fineness.
It's now producing even grounds which are not clumpy - so am able to make proper espresso again.
Thank you very much Ben. Your instructions were excellent - and if I get another couple of years useful life out of the machine I'll be very happy.
Your page here is much appreciated.
Thanks Mike! I love hearing stories like this. Great to know that the fix works for the BCG800 and the BCG800XL just the same. Others have asked about that and so I'm sure your story will clarify things for others! Enjoy your espresso!
Don't try this on the BCG 820 the impeller doesn't come close and Breville have made it impossible to remove the gear burr hopper assembly without butchering it, $45 and 2 hours of my life gone forever..............sorry!
Ugh, that's sad new Peters. Thanks for finding out for the rest of us and I'll add a warning about the BCG820 for others. Sorry you were the unfortunate one to find out for the rest of us. I had high hopes for the 820 myself before this discovery.
I have the model BCG800CBXL “with dosing IQ” that changes the “dose” depending on the grind fineness setting. Recently, with fixed “number of cups” setting and grind fineness, the amount of coffee output by the grinder has been decreasing. I had a few events where the exit chute got clogged and the motor began to race. And then I found this page; thanks for writing it, Ben! I inspected my impeller and sure enough, the blades were worn down away from the edges of the grinding chamber. I ordered the replacement impeller from Shapeways. A long shafted Craftsman #2 Phillips screwdriver worked for reaching the top cover screws. I cleaned the exit chute. I did not reinstall the felt washer and my upper burr sits a wee bit above where it used to on the spindle, but the impeller fit perfectly with no sanding. The grinder runs as expected after reassembly! But I am still having to select a large number of cups on the front panel to get the desired output amount.
Hi Bill,
Interesting issue, and a new one for me. Are the beans fairly oily? With dark, oily roasts the grounds sometimes get sticky. A dry, light roast is worth testing just to see if it makes a difference. Additionally, check the burrs for wear. If the upper and lower burrs have touched while grinding, then it would wear them down fast. Lastly, next time it's grinding slow, stop it mid grind, unlock and remove the hopper. Check that there is a decent amount of beans making it to the upper-burr. Tip them out, and then pull the upper burr and inspect the chamber to see if the grounds are sparse or densely packed. Sparse means beans aren't getting ground as fast as the impeller is emptying them. Dense means it's getting backed up / clogged (possibly at the chute). I think this youtube video matches the problem you describe: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVOOLuQs...
They don't say what was wrong, however I definitely notice it sounds wrong. It should sound like this: https://youtu.be/k5E1O3hvAOI?t=4m7s
Thanks Ben. Of course I meant to say "lower burr" above. The beans are oily so that could be a factor. I notice that the grounds are getting a lot of static electricity since I replaced the impeller, and I get grounds clinging all the way up the walls of the plastic output container. The grinder sounds normal, unlike the one in the first video link above. I will try checking the burr state and the flow process as you suggest.
Bill -
What can I do if the burr is still sitting too high after tightening the nut and washers? I thought it was close enough but you can hear that the burrs are barely touching on a fine grind after reassembling the BCG800XL.
Hi Rachael. First try really tightening the nut a bit extra (Snapping your wrist with the ratchet until the motor turns from the torque will really squash everything down). If it already is that tight, the next option is to take the impeller out and sand on the bottom inside cup where it rests on the washer. Keep checking it against pic #2 in step 20 until it sits just like the picture. Alternatively, instead of sanding the impeller, another option is to change out or sand down the washer underneath the impeller. How far off from the picture is it? BTW, If you shoot me a pic at coffeegrinderhelp@steadymouse.com I'm happy to take a look. I'd like to figure out if the issue is from variation in the impeller printing or variation from grinder to grinder. I've seen this one other time so far.
I just sent the pictures to your email address. Sorry for the delay! I finally had time to take it apart again this morning.
Hi Rachael, Thanks for the photos and detailed info! I've updated Step 11 and Step 20 thanks to your help. It sure does seem like the impeller came out too thick. The new instructions in Step 20 above should get you up and running again. If you discover anything more along the way, I'll be here.
Hi all,
I can add the information that the original part can be purchased from Gastroback (the Gastroback 42639 is identical to the Breville and Sage Smartgrinders). As their representative politely wrote to me: You need the „Fan“ (98312) It costs 1,49€ + freight + VAT.
I forgot check this Ifixit post before reinstallation and simply tapped the impeller gently into place. It was a bit worrying while I did it as I realized that I was close to damaging a much more expensive part of the machine - it did work however..
Cheers Jacob Jacobsen
Hi Bill
A big thanks for the fix instructions and the design. I had the same issue and decided to buy 2 of your impellers as the freight to NZ was the same. Put it in and worked no problems - awesome!
Neal Martin NZ
Glad to hear it Neal! Thanks for the note.
Hi Ben, I purchased replacement impeller, fitted great,but still have clacking sound, have had a look doesn't seem to be any stripped gears, has anyone had any luck fixing torque limiter?
Many thanks Danny
Gisborne. New Zealand
Hi Danny,
No one has reported a successful fix yet, only talked about what they might try. It's good news that your gears are in good shape however, and there are things to try:
I have a new idea if you don't mind experimenting a bit. Take a look at the pic in Step 21 above, specifically the gear on the left. If you take that nut off the gear and pull it apart there are springs and ball bearings around the gear's edge that make up the torque limiter mechanism (Careful not to lose them). I recommend taking each spring and stretching it just a little by hand (Maybe 1 mm or 2 mm longer). Then reassemble the gear/limiter mechanism, and tighten the nut back on extra snug. This should greatly increase the torque required to begin slipping/clacking, while still leaving the safety function in tact. If it works for you, I'll add it to the steps up above. Good luck!
Thank you Ben. I was ready to toss our grinder after a short 3 years. Then I stumbled upon your awesome guide! The shape way gear is definitely an improvement as well as your suggestion for the light coating of oil in the exit chute.
Glad you're up and running again Mark!
Thanks for the great fixit guide Ben,
unfortunately the rachetting noise in my BCG800XL grinder was due to the plastic worm drive gear (right side of picture in step 21). A few teeth on the outside of the gear are sheared off. I had to take the gears off and inspect them closely to find the damage. Kudos to anyone who has disassembled their grinder to this point, it isn't easy. I'm still a little concerned about getting it back together.
I suspect the problem is that the torque limiter was poorly calibrated and a rock in the beans created enough torque for the thin stainless worm drive shaft to shear the plastic before the torque limiter released - if it ever released. I thought about getting a new gear from the guy selling them on ebay, but expect the same thing would happen again.
I'm currently looking into having the gear made from aluminum or brass, which would prevent shearing and still protect the drive gear. I believe the torque limiter would still protect its own gears.
I'll post the price for the gear and where to order it when I find out. If it is only affordable to have more than one made, I'll ask here if any others are interested in getting one.
Hi Dylan, Nice investigation work and best of luck! That drive gear is the common failure point when folks get a rock jammed in the burrs. Having a metal option for replacing the gear would be really great.
Ben - I purchased a couple of the replacement impellers through the ShapeWays website - I have purchased them for using in a Breville BES860XL espresso machine integrated grinder as someone else commented on here that it worked - as you cant access the impeller from the top with this machine I had to disassemble the torque limiter (as shown in figure 21) to get the worn impeller out - the problem is that my kid somehow messed up all the washers and I dont know what goes back where when I reassemble the torque limiter. Are you able to provide a diagram of what nuts and washers go where when reassembling?
Hi Dave, I've asked another user who is far more knowledgeable on the BES860. Hopefully more to come.
Unfortunately, no info on the washer placement. The user I asked did provide a handful of pics he took during BES860XL teardown though. Perhaps it will help indirectly. See here: https://imgur.com/a/kUf7M
For those that are interested - the main drive gears are available at Forum Appliances website for less than $5 each - way less than the price being quoted on eBay.
http://www.forumappliances.com/parts-acc... under part number P-BCG820BSS130
I hope this helps some of you as it is another common fault with Breville products.
That is an awesome find! You just helped a ton of folks out Dave! Everyone's searched high and low for that gear online!
Sorry but this repair guide is anything but a guide. What a complete waste of time and effort. I think its great that you created the part on your own and I'm genuinely happy with the purchase. But I think you should have had other folks try to follow your instructions first prior to posting them. There are many incorrect statements and assumptions made, and the parts recommended are incorrect as well.
I'm at a bit of a loss. Over 150 folks have repaired successfully with this guide. Could you email me at coffeegrinderhelp@steadymouse.com? I'd like to understand where you ran into trouble so I can fix it.
How long will this replacement last. I ask since I don't know anything to these kind of plastic.
Is it the same durability as the original, better, not so good.
Hi John, I've been using mine every day for 6 months now and I make at least 3 double shots of espresso each day (18g of coffee each) . This puts me at a little over 21 lbs of coffee, all fine ground for espresso, since I installed the v4 impeller. Every month or two I use an airgun to clean out the lower chamber and take a look at how it's holding up. On one occasion, 3 months ago, I did a complete disassembly to see in detail. So far the wear is not visibly noticeable. Even the tiny cylinders you can see on the impeller blade tips are not worn off yet. Either the 3D printed nylon is very tough stuff, or perhaps there is less friction because the blade geometry does a better job keeping the lower chamber empty. In short, my own experience has it being way better than the original design. I'll be continuing to keep an eye on it and will post back if I ever get it to fail. So far so good though.
Thanks for the great tutorial! I couldn't have opened my grinder without it. Trust me i tried. Unfortunately my main gear is shot. Does anyone know where I can purchase one? Seems like most places are out of stock. I live is the US.
There's a guy on ebay selling them, only way overpriced if you ask me. I have an idea though. If you google "custom made gear" there are a bunch of shops out there that offer to make gears for people. Many look like you can send the old gear to them and they handle the details. Not sure the lead time or the cost, however it's worth a shot.
Emailed forum appliances website and they found more in stock. Get them while they last.
Nice thinking! Really glad to hear this Mike.
Mike where did you find the gear? I've been looking for a few weeks. I'm not paying $50 for the ebay ones. Thanks!
wrighttw -
This site here: http://www.forumappliances.com/breville-... Looks like they're out of stock again. You may have to contact them like Mike did.
Thanks so much for posting this and all of the work to document it.
Thanks Tom! I enjoy it.
Thanks! I just received the part and the installation was easy. Grinder is back to making nice fine grounds.
Glad to hear it Larry!
Hi Ben,
My years old Breville Smart Grinder is making this ratcheting noise, more frequently lately and I've noticed that it's mainly when I try to grind my own home roasted beans. These beans may be a little lighter than commercially roasted beans at times. It does not make the noise while free running ie I don't think any gears have been stripped.
After reading your guide, I cleaned the grinder out and removed the top and bottom burrs, then cleaned again so that I could inspect the impeller properly. The ends of the impeller blades were not clearly visible and the impeller would not come out of the chamber.
Can you suggest any other reason for this noise or another fix? If it helps I can send you a jpg pic of the impeller blades. Have you experienced the fault with light roasted beans and maybe I need to roast to a darker bean?
Thanks very much for any suggestions,
Graeme.
Hi Graeme,
Light roasted beans are harder for the grinder. Dark roasts are indeed easier and worth a shot. The clacking sound you hear comes from the torque limiter in the BCG800XL gearbox. It slips to protect the gears whenever the torque is too high between the grinding burrs.
Run with some darker beans to see if it grinds without any issue. If it still clacks, then it's either the torque limiter slipping too easily or the impeller is worn enough that it's a problem.
If the torque limiter is going off too easily, you'll have to open the gearbox and take apart the gear. I don't cover this, but if you're comfortable doing so, you could try stretching the springs in that limiter to make it slip at a higher torque (Mentioned in step 21).
Since your grinder is "years old", I'm leaning towards the impeller still being the likely culprit, even if the edges aren't quite visible yet. The clearer that lower chamber stays, the less likely it is to back-up grinds into the burr mechanism and overload it.
Thanks, Ben You are a legend. I'll let you know how I go.
WOW! Amazing source of information! Ben what an incredible job you have done! I own 2 of these grinders - one black & one silver. The black grinder will frequently (ok regularly) quit grinding beans and make a high pitched squealing sound. If I remove the hopper, remove the burrs, clean everything, reassemble everything then it will work...for awhile. I thought the black one had a bent shaft or damaged gear....possibly from a tiny stone mixed in with my beans. But having read your fixit guide I am having 2nd thoughts. OTOH the silver grinder works perfectly EXCEPT that the display fails to show changes in grind size. Yes the grind actually changes - it's just that the bar display doesn't register any changes. I guesstimate where the dial should be. I briefly considered moving the grinding "module" from the silver grinder with the bad display into the black unit with the working display but grinding issues. How difficult would it be to swap the "grinding" hardware from one unit to the other? TIA
Interesting. The high pitch squeal is usually a bad sign and worth checking the gearbox for teeth damage. The good news is making one working grinder out of the two should definitely be doable. Swapping the grinding mechanism from the silver one into the black one should work. OTOH, I think fixing the silver one will be easier. The display not updating is probably just the "digital encoder". Take a look at the pic in Step 8. The encoder is driven by the tiny gear and measures grind position for the display. Make sure that tiny gear is engaged to the big one and that no wires are broken off. If the encoder itself has gone bad you could swap it with the good one from the black grinder. BTW, when you rotate the encoder gear by hand, there is a hard stop built in. You'll want to count the turns until it hits the stop so that you can set the replacement encoder to the exact same position. TLDR: Check the gear box (on black) and check the encoder (on silver). Might be possible to fix both. 1 for sure.
Ben...regarding the high pitch squeal....think dentist office. Should make your teeth hurt. Thanks for the heads up on fixing the silver unit. The display works (ie it is not dead) but merely fails to show any 'dialed' grind changes. The 'marker' is stuck on the far left hand side of the scale. Turn the grind dial and the 'marker' dances for a second or two but fails to move. Per your comments I think that first I will get the silver unit to correctly display the grind changes. Then I will attack the black one and check the gear box. Right now the silver one is used for grinding for a drip MoccaMaster (my wife's go to machine) or for an AeroPress (my choice when time is not an issue). Two different grind sizes. I snagged the silver one for $40 from a salvage retailer here in C'bus. The black unit I bought new and I probably damaged the gear box while grinding some home roasted beans. Again, thank you for the wealth of information AND for sharing it! Really appreciate your updated response too.
Thank You! I just installed the shapeways impeller (I was hoping to fall within your 10-35 minute window, but missed by a couple minutes-oh well!). The part was great, no sanding or filing needed. My old impeller was completely shot after 3 years, but I wouldn't have attempted this repair if I hadn't found your website and seen your detailed instructions. The pictures and step-by-step guide were perfect. My only difficulty was removing the big gear assembly (it took a fair amount of force to pop it off), but everything else was as you described. For those who had trouble finding a long screwdriver, I purchased a Kobalt 12" #2 screwdriver at our local Lowes yesterday (in stock, $8.98) and it was both long enough and narrow enough to fit into the holes. Anyway, thanks for all your work putting together the repair guide and creating the 3D impeller - very impressive. There are a lot of espresso drinkers out there who can once again enjoy their drinks throughout the day, thanks to you. Cheers!
Thanks for the story Jack. It really improved my evening. Enjoy your espresso in the morning.
Thank you so much! Thorough guide, great descriptions and fixed the problem. I must have moved one of the gears so that even though my marks matched up, it was limited by one of the screws. I ended up backing off one of the screws like in the mod instead of taking it all apart. Cheers, Russ
Glad to hear it Russel! Cheers to you also.
I was going to come here to ask about static electricity causing problems with the grinds FLYING all over the place, even defying gravity!
However, this issue was addressed here. I'll try it and report back.
THANKS!
Ahh, I love this description. Hopefully "Troubleshooting #1" took care of you.
For those of you that need to replace the main gear (mine had a few chipped teeth) the cheapest place to find one is here:
http://www.forumappliances.com/breville-...
Following this guide and going a bit further it's quite easy to replace. Mine is now working perfectly again. Don't forget to add more grease to the new gear and align the grind adjustment back to its original position. Don't pay the $90 service charge when you can fix it yourself for ~$10!
Hi Ben, I'm following the tutorial and so far so good. I'm reassembling in step 15 and trying to get the 4 screws in with a long screw driver but can't seem to get the screws to line up into the holes. My screw driver doesn't have a magnetic tip which I am sure would help but do you have any tricks you use during this step?
Thanks
Ben
Hi Ben, Do you have a magnet? The stronger the better. You can magnetize the screwdriver by rubbing a magnet against it for a minute or two. If not this, perhaps put a dab of sticky-glue on the screwdriver tip and then place the screw on the tip. Let the glue set until it stays. Then proceed to screwing it back into the BCG800.
Thanks Ben, I ended up using blue tac but your post got me thinking in the right direction
hi Ben, i bought the impeller and was hoping the BCG860 impeller is compatible for BCG600SIL grinder. Hence i did followed your instruction however step 5 onward is different. I am having difficulty removing the top cover. Do you have any suggestion ? Or exploded view for BCG600 grinder?
The BCG600SIL is new territory for me. That said, if you take a few pics of the current teardown state, I'll take a look and see if I can figure out what the next step is. You can post them to imgur.com or similar and then link here in the comments.
Sorry for the long wait. The BCG600SIL is confirmed to work with the BCG800 impeller. I have written up a repair guide here:
BCG600SIL Dose Control Pro Coffee Grinder - Jamming due to Worn Impeller
Just a thank you note for the impeller design and guide. I contacted Breville after my grinder gave the symptoms you described and couldn't believe they wanted to charge me $90 to fix the problem instead of just sending me a replacement part. I really expected better service from them. In any event, after some Googling I felt very fortunate to get your guide and fix the problem for under $30.
It took me about 20 minutes to complete the repair, thanks to the very thorough guide. Everything worked perfectly the 1st time.
The only small adjustment I would make is the Phillip's screwdriver recommendation you made in the comments. I ordered that thing from Amazon and it it HUGE. A scredriver 1/2 of that size would've worked fine.
Glad to hear it. Enjoy your espresso!
Re the BCG600 grinder - I have one too, have bought the part (don't know if it'll fit yet), and am in the process of trying to disassemble. Found a nice exploded diagram at
https://www.needapart.co.nz/buy-online/p...
Got the front panel off - it looks to me like the silver grind adjustment ring has to come off in order to get inside, but hard to find where the clips are w/o damaging. I'll try spudgers made from old credit cards now ...
dave
They appear to have updated the part on newer models of the machine with a new stainless steel impellar part which is far more efficient and shouldn't wear away. Just thought I'd let you all know.
Hi Max! Thanks for the note. Do you have the newer BCG820 rather than the BCG800XL? I'm fairly sure the BCG800XL is the same across the board (plastic impeller) and the stainless one got introduced in the much later models. They likely had to make other changes to the grinder as well, since the stainless impeller's blade geometry looks much too short to work efficiently in the BCG800XL. In any case, I've added a note to "Step #1" above so folks know that if they have a *stainless steel* impeller design their problem is likely elsewhere.
I have what may be a newer BCG820. The official model is BCG820BSSXL. That model DOES NOT have a steel impeller. It is only CLAD in a kind of steel jacket, but that only protects the body of the impeller. It does nothing for the blades that actually push the coffee out. I purchased my BCG820BSSXL from Amazon in Dec, 2015 and has not stopped expelling the coffee.
adolfox -
#adolfox, did you confirm that it was indeed the tips of your plastic impeller which wore down, despite the metal “shroud” in the model 820? If so, it makes you wonder what the purpose of the metal part is (besides perhaps giving us a false sense of quality).
B Flow -
“It does nothing for the blades that actually push the coffee out.” Huh? The stainless cladding over the blades protects them from the sanding action of fine grinds, so I would argue that it does do something. In reality, it IS the blade. But this a POS grinder for the price, underpowered and burrs make contact at the finest settings. At this price point, best look for an italian model with no useless LCD display.
Hi Ben! Thanks for this. I was about to buy a Baratza Vario when I found your tutorial. I have experience with 3D prints, but I think this is the first one that had actual real-world value! My only trouble with the tutorial was the deep screws for the cover. I first had to head to my local hardware store and pick up one of these: https://smile.amazon.com/Eazypower-35795.... It worked because I already had a 1/4 ratchet with a socket designed to take screwdriver bits, but I assume a 1/4 socket would work as well. My next issue came with trying to put those same screws back in, but a guy on youtube really helped out with that one. https://youtu.be/UWfuDG1-vH8 Otherwise, no trouble at all! (Except, maybe, screwing the bottom cover back on. It's weird how they routed the power cord in there.)
I am a little concerned with removing the felt gasket, however. My gasket was coated with fine grounds. No one has had any issue with dust getting inside there?
Hi Zachary! That long screwdriver does seem to be a pain point for folks. Thanks for the useful links! As for the gasket, I think it's OK. The 3D printed impeller both hugs the pedestal more tightly (radially) and the base comes closer to the bottom of the chamber. Both of those leave less room for dust to ingress. That said, I'm coming up on a full year of daily use (3 double shots of espresso each day at 18g of coffee each) with my BCG800XL and ShapeWays impeller. I plan to do a full teardown at that time and that will be more definitive. So far so good though, as it's been clipping along great with no signs of slowing down.
After the swap, it is not grinding anywhere close to fine enough for my espresso machine. I looked into the shim kit, but Breville customer service was not responding to web requests or tweets (and not answering their phone at 4:40 on Friday, when the website says they are open until 5:00), so I looked around elsewhere. It seems the shim kit is no longer available. I checked into buying .2mm shims of the correct size, but the fewest number I could find were in lots of 700, at a cost of $112. I thought about ordering them and selling lots of 10 on ebay, but that would be a pain. Anyway, I went to Ace Hardware and bought a zinc M10 fender washer, as it has the exact ID and OD of the original. I then took to sanding on plate glass; I got the washer from 1.5mm to 1.1mm before I gave up. (the original is .5mm). I decided to try it out anyway, and when I ran the machine dry, the burrs don't touch. I plan to give it a go in the morning and see if I can't get a proper grind (or seize it from too fine grinds!)
Interesting, especially at 1.1mm on that washer since that's quite a lot. I'd still give Breville a call when they are open. There was another comment above from someone who successfully got the shim kit from them just last year. Also, don't forget: If you still need further adjustment range you can always try "Step 13 Optional Modification for Better Grind Adjustment Range". It's a bit of a hack, however used responsibly, it works very well and there's no way I'd go back after using it for ~9 months now. FYI: One other thing to watch out for with this grinder is there's a bit of lag in the fineness. When I make an adjustment from coarse to fine, it usually takes grinding about 36 grams until the fineness of the grounds coming out "catch up" to the new setting. In any event, hope your mods work out well. Cheers!
Hi Ben. Thanks for the great tutorial on addressing the design flaw for Breville coffee grinders. My BCG600SIL has just recently started jamming. Upon closer inspection, it looks like the impeller will need to be replaced. Just wondering if anyone has had any success in taking apart this model. There have been a couple of posts above with others having the same problem. The top of the grinder doesn't come off, even after taking out all the screws from underneath. I suspect that since the BCG600SIL model is made of moulded plastic, there are hidden tabs on the inside that keep the unit together. Before I start prying the top of the unit off with brute strength, can somebody shed some light on whether this is the best way of going about it? Or have I missed taking out a screw somewhere? Thanks in advance.
Hi Desmond, Unfortunately I haven't heard much regarding others' success or failure with the BCG600SIL so far. The best information I have is from David Blom's comment above. There's an exploded view of the internals: https://media.needapart.co.nz/manuals/BC...
Perhaps you can see if there's tabs or screws for each part there and hopefully make some headway. Definitely requires a bit more exploration. If you post teardown photos to imgur.com and link back here, I'm happy to take a look as well.
Thanks a lot Ben for this guide!! Very useful and it saved my grinder as the Breville technician represented in a retail banner said he couldn't do anything about it!
I feel I am no longer getting much different grinding levels... I think I might of touch the outside knob when pulling on the big white gear / burr "wheel". Could that be it? I followed your advice with having it at it's finest and marking the 2 white wheels.
I will use the oil trick as I have static issues with the coffee, do you think keeping the little cotton ring would of helped?
Thanks
Luc
Hi Luc! Hmm, aside from the two gears that shouldn't rotate, could the grey plastic cylinder within (ie: the upper burr holder) have gotten spun a bit? That part shouldn't be allowed to turn either. In any case, take a look at Step #20 above. Your lower burr height should look just like the 2nd pic. There are some tips listed that you can try if it doesn't. In addition to this, there is also the "last resort" option of the modification in Step #13. Between those two you should be able to get to a desired grind again. It's possible to mess with the gears also, but very difficult to get right. Not worth the risk unless you're sure it got messed up during disassembly.
I have a BCG400SIL which appears to be sold in Canada only, a stripped-down version of the BCG600SIL (no timer or lower-burr adjustment). Purchased it late-November 2016 and have been using it daily every morning, about a 1/2 cup of beans finely ground for espresso. It was set at 0 at first, which on my machine, was not quite powder. Not quite fine enough for my taste, but acceptable when tamped down tight. Over time, the grind got finer at this setting, so I slowly started bumping it up to 5, 10 and then 15. In the last month, I started noticing less grinds coming out with the usual quantity of beans. Cleaning did not help much or for long. So 5 months after purchase, it "ground to a halt" with the motor stopping mid-grind. That's when I took it all apart. The area around the impeller and the chute was completely caked. Not knowing this was a bad thing at the time, I was able to lift out the impeller with a bit of jimmying. The felt washer was completely shredded. (continued...)
(...continued) So I cleaned it all out, put it back together thinking I fixed it, but it jammed up again immediately. That's when I came across this page which I want to thank you for, as it gave me a clue to what was going on. It certainly is not obvious to even someone technically adept, that the nylon impeller was being ground down...right into my morning brew. The latter is something that has not been brought up, but that I think bears consideration: we've been brewing plastic along with our coffee grinds. Minute quantities perhaps, but who can say for sure it has no health impact? Since my unit is under warranty, I will attempt to have it repaired to see if they replace it with a stainless impeller, as noted by Max above. I will try to get that clarified beforehand, but may have to wait before reporting back. For those of you outside warranty, this would still be what should be considered a hidden vice. (continued...)
(...continued) In my home province of Quebec, there are laws that apply in this case, that force the vendor or manufacturer to honour a legal warranty up to three years after purchase. YMMV. Sorry for the long-winded message.
Thanks very much for the excellent repair guide for my 5 year old grinder (works for Gastroback Advanced Pro as it is labeled in Germany) and the industry 4.0 solution. The Shapeways part was delivered from the NL branch in no time (last October) - what are the odds for finding a part like this ready to order? Not observing the instructions in step 12 and accidentally rotating the parts of the burr holder cost me an hour or so- in case this happens the correct position is not fully twisted inwards but approx. 1 full revolution out. When everything was reassembled the grind was too fine and all the grinding time settings far off because of this. This I solved by with a set of 0.3 mm shims- if I recall correctly I ended up with two of these replacing the original washer. Now everything seems back at factory specs and working flawlessly everyday for more than 6 months.
Nice to hear Erik! Yeah, without ShapeWays we'd have been out of luck. I really like them, and it has been a fun project. BTW, if you're interested, I did a teardown of my own grinder at 11 months to see how well the impeller was holding up. Judging from the pics, I think we're in good shape for years to come: https://imgur.com/a/cVgST
Cheers!
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand, IT WORKS! Thanks so much for taking the time to figure out this fix, design the shapefile, make it available at a reasonable price online, and lastly, put together this top notch set of instructions! Shame on Breville for not taking responsibility and offering the part for sale. It is obnoxious in the extreme that they insist on requiring us to send the grinder back to them and charging $100 for the same fix. You are part of what is right with the world, providing quality solutions to counter the throwaway trend in our culture and economy!
Thanks Ben, this guide is excellent and so is your Shapeways part- my AUS version is up and running like new. I didn't modify the impeller at all, it slotted straight in.
A tip for those with ridiculously coarse grinds - I accidentally rotated the "do not rotate" big cog at https://d3nevzfk7ii3be.cloudfront.net/ig... - rotating it back a full turn fixed that. Watch which way the adjuster knob turns it and turn it that way. Start your testing at very coarse in case you got it wrong. This should also work if you turned it around too fine.
To get the lid screw out behind all the wires, I placed the unit face down and pulled back & down on all the wires to get them out of the way. Here's a pic: https://www.dropbox.com/s/epzg8jz02szqq1...
Old vs New impeller: https://www.dropbox.com/s/nn9ub1r2o3a994... Yeah, big difference.
Thanks again Ben for the great replacement part and clear instructions.
Glad to hear it Ewen! Thanks for the feedback!
I just went through this process and figured I'd add my two cents. Thanks to Ben for making this part available. I ordered the part from Shapeways and it was shipped within 24 hours of my order.
The instructions on this page and the youtube video made the whole process easy and straightforward. The new impeller fit perfectly. My only issues were with the coarse grind after re-assembly. I tried a few of the suggestions but they didn't help, and with no shims available I had to get creative. I ended up playing with the rotation of the large ring gear and the burr holder; this was the only way I could compensate for the increased gap between burrs (probably due to removal of felt washer). A full rotation (lowering upper burr) was too much, then I tried half a rotation (requires raising or removing screws so that you can still adjust grind properly from coarse to fine), which was still too much. I settled on about a quarter turn which was about right to compensate for the burr gap increase.
Nice work Ralph. Adjusting the rotation is definitely an advanced modification, however looks like it works well. I'm sure other brave folks will benefit from knowing this. Thanks for the post!
Hi Earl, Is your grinder a BCG800XL? What dimension is too large (radius, thickness, etc)? The impeller should measure up to the following dimensions:
Total diameter (blade tip to blade tip): 44.67mm
Height [z-axis] (lower base to top surface not including the pegs): 8.56mm
Drive shaft hole width [x-axis]: 10.16mm
Drive shaft hole length [y-axis]: 7.98mm
If any part of that is significantly off perhaps you got a dud. Worst case, ShapeWays has a money back guarantee, so simply contact their customer service team here:
https://www.shapeways.com/contact/contac...
Alternatively if the issue is minor, you can always apply a small bit of sanding to make it right. That said, size issues are very rare, with the one outlined in Step #20 above being the only one that I've encountered on occasion. Report back and we'll go from there.
AWESOME! The replacement went trouble free thanks to your well detailed guide and all the efforts you have put in reverse engineering the impeller for 3D printing. Thanks a million! FWIW, I took a few pictures of before/after: https://imgur.com/a/Z3h0s.
Hi Normand! This is great! Man was that impeller worn down! Thanks for the feedback, and for putting together a glimpse of how it went! Enjoy your coffee!
Repair seemed to go well, but the grinder no longer stops at 2 cups. It just keeps going. Any suggestions? Thx.
That's a new one! Very interesting. Perhaps a wire got pinched creating an electrical short somewhere, or something mechanically is interfering with the activation switch. Or even, possibly from cleaning, water or coffee ingress into the switch mechanism or something.
I have the same problem. Did you find a solution?
It almost has to be related to the display, since all the smarts that control grind time are located there. I would pull it out again, inspect the wires for signs of damage/pinching, and then very carefully reassemble while watching that the wires are not getting pinched against anything. Additionally, make sure the button is not stuck down. Lastly, check the other switch, that the portafilter presses. Maybe it is stuck pressed or something.
I used this part to repair the Breville Barista Express BES860XL. I was having problems with the grinder jamming. Brushing and vacuuming out the accumulation in the grinding cylinder would alleviate the problem, but it got to where I had to do it with each use. I concluded I needed to replace the impeller or fan as Breville calls it.
ADDITIONAL STEPS FOR THE 860
There are a number of differences from the repair Ben depicts. In the 860 the upper burr is attached to the drive shaft; it cannot be removed from the top by removing the lock washer. A number of additional steps are required to remove the drive shaft and burr which sits on top of the impeller.
- The entire grind assembly needs to be lifted out. There are 4 obvious screws with washers to remove.
- The motor needs to be removed from the gear reduction box. Again, the 4 screws were obvious; however the back of the machine needed to be taken off to have enough room to work without breaking the motor wiring harness.
- The gear reduction box needs to be taken apart. This requires some care as the torque limiter has 6 ball bearings on top of 6 springs. These would be easy to lose.
- The drive shaft should slide out. The first time I took the machine apart, it did. The second time ... well, I didn't put the drive plate on tightly enough, and as a result the end of the drift shaft mushroomed over the drive plate so it would not come off without a fair bit of sanding. Oof.
MODIFYING THE IMPELLER UPGRADE
The drive shaft for the 860 is circular rather than flattened on both sides (although I believe this too has changed for the 8700. So I used a Dremel to bore out the hole of the Ben/Shapeways replacement. The posts on top of the new impeller where thicker than the original--over 3 mm vice 2 mm for the original. I thought I would have to shave them down to fit into the burr, but they fit perfectly. It fit perfectly into the grind cylinder with no sanding.
PERFORMANCE OF THE REPAIRED GRINDER
The new impeller works well. Rather than a trickle of grounds, it produces a torrent, some of which sprays over the edges of the portafilter. I think this is because the grounds are being swept out as they are produced, rather than being nudged toward the chute with the smaller impeller.
A more interesting phenomenon is this: the grounds are lofted. They used to be dense, almost sticky. Now they poof up. Again, I believe this is because they are coming out immediately rather than being compacted as they are nudged to the chute.
I am very happy with the repaired espresso maker, and extremely grateful to Ben for diagnosing the problem, designing a solution to it, and describing the repair in such terrific detail!
Great work Geoff! The BES860 sounds a lot harder than the BCG800. I'm sure others will appreciate this bit of detail you've added in the future! Thanks for the writeup and enjoy your coffee!
5 months after install, and the grinder is working flawlessly! As some have commented, the grinder with the new impeller was spewing grounds everywhere for the first few months (as it had when new, and even though I followed the recommendation to coat with vegetable oil the new impeller and chute), but now that behavior is no longer occurring. Stellar experience, thanks!
Thanks for the long term results Phil! It's so funny how the overspray goes away after awhile. Same experience here, except it took just a few days. I'll nominate for a Nobel in physics anyone who gets to the bottom of that one. Also just to clarify, don't ever coat the impeller with oil. Just the chute. I'm pretty sure oil in the chamber itself is a negative (at least till it gets absorbed).
I just replaced impeller. followed instruction step by step. not difficult from the beginning to the end but the problem started after putting the beans. as soon as beans in, the machine started making noise as if there were no beans inside. when I look at detail, the lower burr was not moving. any thought and suggestion?
thanks
tom
Hi Tom, That sounds potentially gearbox related. Is it like this video here? https://youtu.be/PcQcbHIPqx8?t=1m17s One of the comments on that explains it as "its the motor spline rubbed the plastic cog groves away, the spline is metal and the internal gears cogs are some sort of plastic, when the rock jams the Burr then the motor spline keeps turning and rubs a flat spot on the plastic cog." Getting into the gearbox is a bit more work than the ifixit article covers, however Step 21 has some info to get you started.
Hey all! Ben, thank you very much for your time / energy put towards helping repair this thing!
Now, a question: I have this sound https://goo.gl/BPdiYU on the FIRST DAY that I got my grinder. I’ll admit that I was using home roasted beans, which are medium / light (actually more of a medium roast but because of the method I’m using there are some very light beans and some very dark beans also!). If you don’t feel like clicking the link, it’s the “clacking” sound, and it happens without beans in the hopper (and in fact with the trop part of the burr / grinder removed completely). I’m guessing I have to repair something, but before I get into taking the thing apart (on day one!) I was hoping somebody might be able to give a listen and give an opinion / confirmation that the sound you’re hearing is something that will require repair.
Thanks for your time!
Kevin
Hi Kevin, That sounds like gearbox problems. Here’s a similar one that had a rock get jammed in the burrs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcQcbHIP... If it’s a new unit (and not refurbished) it should still be under warranty. Breville is great at replacing stuff in that case and I’d go that route. If you do try to fix it, I would first unplug the unit and then put a ratchet on the acorn nut on the lower burr. Then manually rotate it around counter-clockwise a few times so the motor and gear train spins. It’s supposed to feel smooth throughout the rotation. Make sure the burrs are not hitting at all. If you do tear the thing down to check the gearbox, check both the gear-teeth and also check the torque limiter gear (Shown in Step 21 above). If it slips too easily, you may need to tighten the nut on it a bit.
Question: Why make the replacement part from plastic like the original one? If you take one of the new plastic parts and use it to create a mold you can have a metallic one which it can be a permanent fix.
It would be mostly unaffordable for folks. Shapeways offers metal print options however it is more than 5x the price. Print resolution is much lower as well after going from a print to a casting, and the tolerances are already pretty tight as is. Lastly, the nylon material holds up very well. I dare say it holds up significantly better than Breville’s original design. If you like, check out the wear study I did after almost a year of use in my BCG800XL: https://imgur.com/a/cVgST
Everything went fine with the replacement, but I’m afraid it didn’t work for our BCG800. It still produces way too little output even with the new impeller.
Hi Louis, Are the beans a really dark and oily roast? Too oily and it can form a paste that is difficult to expel. If you are up for investigating, I recommend tracing the flow of a few beans through the grinder. Do they make it from the hopper onto the upper burr OK? Do they get ground up OK? Do they become “caked up” in the lower chamber or get expelled properly (Pull the burr and look)? Do they come out in pasty-clumps or like fine-powder? With the device unplugged, you can put a ratchet on the lower burr and force it (by hand) to rotate counter-clockwise with a few beans placed on the burrs. Then observe how it goes. You should also be able to feel the geartrain and motor rotating smoothly during this.
Thank you Ben for this part. I want to say Shapeways were a pleasure to deal with their site has great communication, very professional. I installed your part but it ground just a bit too course for espresso on finest setting. I measured your part at 4.85mm thick (where it matters between washers) and the old Breville part is 5.29mm about 0.5mm difference. So I engineered up a 1.22mm washer (this thickness was what I had at hand and seemed suitable, thinning it more is tricky) to replace the shim (0.5mm) beneath the impeller. This worked well at fining the grind. I'm still fine tuning my dials but very successful thank you. Your part fit perfectly and I took the advice given in these comments to order two as the freight was the same to NZ.
Nice improvisation Chester. You might also benefit from “Step 14: Optional Modification for Better Grind Adjustment Range”. Making a custom shim is probably higher quality result in the end though. Thanks for the helpful feedback and glad to hear you are up and running in NZ again.
This is excellent info and I just wish I had it sooner! I'd like to remove the fiber washer underneath the impeller and use a thinner washer to hopefully improve the coarse end. Then I could play with shimming underneath the bottom burr to improve the fine end.
This is excellent info and I just wish I had it sooner! I'd like to remove the fiber washer underneath the impeller and use a thinner washer to hopefully improve the coarse end. Then I could play with shimming underneath the bottom burr to improve the fine end.
Order placed!
I just installed the impellor I bought from Shapeways, Having the same problem the grinds get below the impellar and doesn't push out the chute. The chute is clear. It appers the center thickness of the impeller keeps it a bit higher than it should and allows for a gap below the impeller for the grinds to go. Shoud I return impeller to Shapeways?
thanks, Bob M
Hi Bob,
This is a new one for me. Could there be vertical slop in the drive shaft allowing the “shaft + burr + impeller” to rise up when grinding starts? It is never normal to get grounds underneath the impeller (other than the little bit that below the outer blades). If you pull upwards on the acorn nut on the lower burr, I would be curious if there is significant vertical play. It could potentially point to an issue on the opposite end of the drive shaft inside the gearbox. Perhaps the nut on the left side of the pic in Step 23 is loose and when the grinds build up, they succeed in lifting the impeller and lower burr up. This is all a wild guess. You can also check the measurements to make sure you didn’t get a defective impeller. The impeller center thickness you refer to, that sets burr elevation, should be around 4.9mm. The bottom of the ShapeWays page has more measurements you can check as well.
Smartways impellar install seems to sit to high causing grinds to be pushed under impeller. It appears that the center thickness of the Shapeway impellar does not allow the impeller to sit low enough to force grinds out the completely cleared chute, the burr also seems to sit about flush as it should.
Should I return impeller to Shapways?
thanks, bobm
See my other comment above, hopefully we can get to the bottom of the issue. You can definitely contact ShapeWays though if you prefer that route.
Why would someone pay $ 250-$300 for this grinder and have to go through this replacement process, you would be buy a better off, buying a better brand, grinder and stay away from Breville!!!
First of all, I’d like to say these were the best instructions I’ve ever followed, ever. For anything. So well-written with excellent photos. I’m moderately handy but never tried fixing an appliance before and this made it so easy. Also, I think I fixed my grinder! Thanks again for taking the time to put this together.
Thanks Jason, that means a lot! The occasions with good feedback make it worthwhile. Enjoy your coffee.
Hi Ben, Thank you so much for this awesome guide. I completed it and turned my grinder back on and press start but nothing happens. I went back and repeat it all the steps and looked for a loose wires but I didn’t see anything. Has this ever happened to you or anyone else you’ve talk to? The machine powers on and I can change the number of shots and the amounts and the finness, but the grinder won’t actually grand anything. I would love your thoughts on it if you have time . Thanks so much
Hi Eric, It sounds like a problem with the safety switch that prevents activation when the hopper is off. Maybe it got knocked out of place or a wire came off during disassembly. You can see the switch clearly in this video, being pressed by the screwdriver: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcQcbHIP...
Thank you so much for this walkthrough! I thought I was going to have to break down and buy another burr grinder. I have a hand grinder I have been using as a replacement while waiting for the new impeller to arrive. Your thorough guide saved me from carpal tunnel! Thanks again!
Thanks Ryan, glad to be able to help!
Ryan Johnson, the founder and owner of Badsea Coffee roasters in Carlsbad, CA!? Your coffee is absolutely amazing!
did the fix. grinding works but grinds are now seeming to shoot out from all over, making a mess on the counter, grinds stuck to metal parts on the outside. I tried oiling the chute, and putting some water in with the grinds, but it hasn’t helped. Any suggestions? About to buy another grinder. Don’t know if its static (which would be a lot) or overspray, but it’s A LOT of grinds all over the place. thanks, chris
Hi Christian,
I have seen this before with an ultra dark roast. Does that fit the description of the beans you have by chance? I would try going to a medium or light roast for at least a week. There is a break-in period where the new impeller gets a coffee coating and things usually settle down after that. Charcoal-dark roasts though are harder for some reason. Also, to get you through the break-in period, you could grind into a glass cup to both catch the grounds better and reduce static. I will be here.
Ben
I have the same problem with my Barista express BES860XL
Do yon know if yoor hand made impeller does work in tha machine?
Hi Hugo,
If you search the comments above you will find discussion of the BES860 from a few others. From what I gather, it requires drilling out the center hole of the impeller, and also teardown of the unit is more work. There unfortunately is not an iFixit guide either, however it has been done though.
I recently had a case of very oily beans clogging up the replacement 3D printed impeller and chute, with eventually no output. Unfortunately I left it too long cleaning the grime out, leading to the 2 little lugs shearing off, as the grinder clacked away. Luckily I’d bought 2 replacements at the time and all is good again. I think part of the problem with the breakage is I had to put in extra washers provided by Breville, when my grinds were too coarse, so the burr on top would not be sitting snug. Certainly no complaints, it was my fault, and there was virtually no wear on the first impeller. I’ve kept the original, as I might be able to replace the lugs sometime in the future.
Cheers
Neal
Hi Neal, Glad you had a backup option. The really dark oily beans are definitely the roughest on any grinder too. That said, make sure you really crank down the acorn nut so that burr will be snug. If you need to you can always use the trick here to get more grind range another way: Störung an der BCG800XL Mühle wegen abgenutztem Flügelrad
Best of luck ahead and appreciate the update.
Ben
Hi, I installed a 3d printer impelled , seems to fit perfectly, I check all the levels and the reinstallation was successful, run ok without beans , but the burrs jammed when placing beens on it. I tried rice beans and still jam. I do not think the impeller was the problem! any suggestion? thanks!
If it is making the ratcheting sound, or is it more like a high pitch whirr? If the latter, the drive gear may be stripped. If the former, then the next thing to check is the torque limiter. You will have to tear down to the gear box to see it. There is a gear with a metal slip-plate on it containing ball-bearings and springs. This is the torque limiter that slips and makes the ratcheting sound. If you take it apart, stretch each of the springs 1 or 2 mm and clean any grease off the bearings and the plate. You want to make it harder to slip (A drop of sugar water might not hurt). Additionally, crank the nut down on it pretty hard too.
Störung an der BCG800XL Mühle wegen abgenutztem Flügelrad
When in there, inspect the gear teeth too. If it’s a bad gear you can replace it.
AWESOME! This worked great. I ordered the part (and a long enough screw driver) and it fit like a dream. The guide was super easy to follow too. And now, my grinder works great again. Not sure the exact cause (cause I clean it regularly) but I am now getting less fines and my pour overs are way better. So stoked.
Let me add mine to the long list of thank-yous. I ordered the part from Shapeways and got delivery within a week; your guide is exceptionally clear, and I was able to perform the replacement in less than half an hour. I’ve got espresso again!
Hi,
I have Breville 860 espresso machine and I having problem: the coffee grind pour coffee out too slow, it look loke jam some where. May I use this one to improve the situation?
And BTW, in my machine, I do not see the nut, how can I open the lower burr?
Tks!
Search the page for 860 and you can read through the comments of others have done so. Teardown is harder, not having a guide, and the impeller needs the center hole rounded out from what I gather. You can decide if it’s worth the effort from the comments.
Hello Ben,
Great job on the impeller by the way. I finally sold my Smart after way too many repairs and bought a Baratza Forte. No more problems. So here’s the rub. I have a Breville Barista Express Espresso machine with the built in grinder. Coffee gets stuck just like the Smart. Since I don’t have the Smart anymore I can’t do an impeller comparison. Do you know if the two impellers are interchangeable? If not might you be able to fabricate one for me. I’m one of thousands of people that own a Barista Express and have this problem. There may even be new market potential for you.
Peace,
Tony
Hi Tony, From comments others have left I understand that the impeller for the express has the center hole rounded out. If you search this page for 860 or Express you can read through the comments of others have done the swap. FYI: teardown is harder, not having a guide, and the impeller needs the center hole rounded out from what I gather. You can decide if it’s worth the effort from the comments.
Ben thanks for the reply. Please forgive my ignorance but how do I do a search on this page?
I should add that the Barista Express I have is not the 860 it is the 870 with a grinder exactly the same as the Smart.
You can press CTRL + F and your browser will open a search box. Then type 860. If that fails, just take a look through the comments on this page starting at the top. Some others have discussed the Express as they worked through their repairs. One user did post some pics of their 860 teardown here: Breville 860 Grinder Teardown
I am unfamiliar with the 870 model’s differences vs the 860. First thing I would check is if the impeller is actually worn down, or if it is the newer stainless steel clad design Breville has begun using (It should not wear down). That way you don’t go through all this trouble only to find out there’s a difference. In case it helps, you can find the exact dimensions of the 3D printed impeller at the bottom of the shop page here for comparison: https://www.shapeways.com/product/NASLAG...
I forgot to add that the original impeller from my Barista Express is about 1 1/2” in diameter.
I joined so I could say Thanks Ben!
The clacking started, so I followed the guide through to confirm the issue was with my impeller. It was!
After 7 years of daily use (and never been cleaned!) my impeller was worn and the chamber under the bottom burr was packed with old caked grinds. It’s a wonder I have had anything coming through it at all.
I’ve just finished giving it a thorough clean and reassemble and it is running like a brand new unit. I had forgotten what good grinds are meant to look like.
Placing an order for a replacement impeller now.
Seven years! That’s a heck of a good run — the longest I have heard of. Glad to be of help here and there. Enjoy your espresso!
Hi Ben,
A few weeks ago I fitted a Shapeways replacement impeller and for the most part, functionality is restored but I cannot load directly into the basket because grinds shoot out all over the place making a huge mess.
This problem seemed partially due to the static issue issue at first but observations suggest that grind is simply flying out at a volume far greater than originally designed and the grinds just hit the basket and fly off in every direction.
Any idea how to control the rate of flow?
Cheers.
Nathan
So I’ve resolved the problem with a little design modification.
I felt that your design was just too different from the original spec so i removed the end of each spur such as to leave a small gap of about 1mm around the outside. This has slowed the rate of flow and mitigated the splashing problem. I do remember that originally, there was a small gap.
Obviously, the replacement impeller will wear down quicker now but I can grind directly into the basket.
Cheers
Hello Ben, I have an issue with my Smart Coffee Grinder BCG800XL: the motor is spinning with the high-pitch squeal, but the impeller and the conical burr are immoveable. What is the problem? It would be better to know it before I decide to disassemble the grinder completely. Thanks in advance. Igor Kogan
Hello Ben, fantastic write up! I wanted to know if the impeller will fit the Smart grinder Pro.
Thanks!
Tasos
Unfortunately the BCG820 (smart grinder pro) has significant differences. Based on feedback from others I do not believe the impeller would fit.
Greetings All… I understand the cause of static charge problem in the coffee grind. (for my case anyway)
The base ring of the replacement impeller is rubbing against the base of the grinder well causing friction…. A static charge then builds up on the impeller which then transfers to the coffee grinds. The simple solution is just to shave away a small amount of the ring at the base of the replacement impeller that touches the bottom of the grinder well. No more friction. No more charge.
Hope this helps.
Nathan, Fascinating idea regarding root cause. Thanks for posting this! Perhaps tolerance stack up results in this on some machines, and if so it would explain why the static cling usually goes away after a bit — regular use would wear off that tiny bit of excess plastic over time. I took a look at my own BCG800’s 2-year wear study photos, hoping to see if there was evidence of wear at the bottom of the impeller or in the well where the ring would touch. It is unfortunately tough to tell: https://photos.app.goo.gl/868a5ReyM2XAyj... Next time I do a teardown I will have a closer look. For anyone struggling with static issues, sanding a little off the bottom of the impeller ring seems worth a shot.
Does anyone know where I could get the torque limiter or new springs for the torque limiter or even a new motor assembly? I have the old smart grinder BCG800XL. My search did not yield any results :(
Hi Ben, thanks much for posting this. I’ve bought the impeller and opened up the grinder. And now I’ve discovered that the black gasket that goes on the inner ring of the Gear / Burr Holder Assembly. Any idea where I can get a replacement on of these?
Thanks much
Ben
Hi Ben, The felt ring under the impeller? See step 9 for details — In short you can discard it. My own grinder has 2.5 years operating fine without it.
Hey Ben,
thanks for getting back to me. No, I’m not talking about the felt gasket. I’m talking about the black rubber gasket that goes around the grey inner ring of what you are calling the “Gear / Burr Holder assembly”. It is black and maybe 0.25” wide.
Thanks again.
Hi Ben, You may have to improvise here. I don’t think that gasket is critically important. I would either glue the old one in place and call it good enough — or perhaps tie a piece of yarn (of similar thickness) around the circumference of the cylinder.
Hi Ben — Thanks for this helpful and thorough guide! I received the part, and did have to sand the internal rounded sided a bit, but then it fit snugly and was shooting out grounds nicely. Having trouble getting a fine and even grind now, though. I did the “mod” with the screws, removed a washer, loosened the nut, checked the alignment… Still a bit coarse - and a bit uneven. Any thoughts? It s=did seem that the inner burr was sitting a bit high, but that would contribute to the opposite problem, correct? Thanks again!
Hi Daniel,
Strange, as you are correct that a higher lower burr would result in a finer grind (no washers are missing from under the impeller, right?).
Could it be the *upper* burr holder assembly (Step 13) is not snapped in properly allowing the upper burr to push upwards? I am wondering if somehow that upper burr is not seating as low as it should. Also, make sure the upper burr is snapped in clockwise all the way. Perhaps try pulling up on it to see if it flexes in the mount at all. You should NOT be able to noticeably increase the gap between upper and lower burr just by pulling.
Anyway those are my first thoughts. This is an unusual scenario.
I have the pro model (820) when I go fine it starts to make that noise and if I go coarser I starts to grind again (without no cleaning required) Mine has the the stainless steel impeller. I already bought an sette 270 but I don’t want to sell my Breville without fixing it. Any ideas where to start?
Just did this a week ago Ben… there is no way to fix the 820 unless you get a custom 3D printed impeller for the 820. The 800 one does not fit. The finer the grind, the more likely it is to jam. While the impeller is in a stainless steel sheathe, it’s just plastic underneath and it does wear out especially if you are using it for espresso. I have just purposed that grinder for pour over only.
I bought a Sette 270 to replace it as well. No clumping, great control, and low grind retention.
Made a comment on step 8, above. After reassembling, the grinder is looking pretty good to me - at least with the white rice test grind...
Thanks so much for the instructions and the shapeways part - I think the grinder is saved, after 15? years of several-times-daily use! Tomorrow morning will tell for sure. And then, the next few weeks will tell regarding the oily bean jam that’s plagued us for the last couple of years. Hopefully many more happy years of use ahead…
Hi Ben
I followed the instructions and replaced the impleller and everything went back together nicely, however I’ve got it set all the way to fine and the grounds are coming out very coarse. So coarse that it’s almost plunger coarseness. Can you please advise what to do. Thanks
Peter
Hi Peter, It may be worth double checking that the two washers under the impeller made it back into place. Also, misalignment of the gears in step 8 might cause this.
If necessary, the optional modification here will get you more range to work with: Störung an der BCG800XL Mühle wegen abgenutztem Flügelrad
Ben
Sorry for taking so long to get back to you; I’ve been travelling and didn’t have any beans.
I followed the steps you outlined and added the hack from step 14 and there’s no significant difference. It’s better, but not much. Certainly, the grinder is not usable for espressos currently.
I went back through your original and follow up instructions and cannot see any difference between what you said and what I did. The gear assembly was marked across all three elements (inside grey collar, large white gear and small white gear), was at the finest setting and clipped back into place neatly. The washers under the impeller are still in place, and I tightened the nut holding the conical grinder with a rachet so the grinder turned. The height of the conical grinder was also as specified. I have a bunch of pics but don’t know how to post them here to show you what I did.
Im stuck and don’t know what to do……
Hi Peter,
If the lower burr height vs the lip on the drive shaft looks correct after double checking, then perhaps the problem is with the upper burr holder. It *must* be the spacing between the burrs, right? Obviously the gear alignment is very important for that spacing, and I believe you could intentionally misalign/rotate the big gear such that the finest setting places the upper burr *lower* for a finer grind, but it would require careful experimenting.
Another thought: Could the upper burr holder be lifting up somehow during grinding? See here: Störung an der BCG800XL Mühle wegen abgenutztem Flügelrad
If any radial plastic snaps broke, then the upper burr holder may flex-upwards as the chamber below it fills with grounds. Ditto if the hard to reach screws are too loose. Focus on the upper burr mounting and inspect the gap to the lower burr. Prying on it and see if there is flexing. It’s going to require investigation, however this seems like a good avenue.
Also, if you want you can upload pics to an imgur album here: https://imgur.com/ and then post back the link. I am happy to take a look.
Ben I’ll digest your comments and get back to you. In the meantime, here’s the link for the pics. Hopefully, they’re posted properly. Lol
Thanks for your help; I really appreciate it.
https://imgur.com/gallery/zo3zUdz
thanks
Peter
Hi Peter,
Looking at the photos, the first image stands out due to the large washer. Did the original get lost? I am wondering if it could be a bit thicker, and thus squashing the impeller more than usual when the acorn nut is tight. I also did not see the two washers that normally reside under the impeller. I know you mentioned checking for them so perhaps they are just not in place when the pics were taken. In case it helps I have added a cutaway diagram here with all the parts, showing how they stack up to set the height of the lower burr: Störung an der BCG800XL Mühle wegen abgenutztem Flügelrad
Hi Ben,
Have model BCG820BSSXL and came across your you tube video replacing the impeller as my symptoms were identical. I realize though that the new model has a steel impeller BUT again my symptoms of very little grounds passing through the discharge chute was the same. [Main point is one day the machine now takes 2-3 times as long to grind the beans (~18grams per cup) so I thought yes maybe I have caked or packed coffee dust…]I did take it apart exposing the shaft to totally clean everything out in the impeller area as well as the chute. So cleaned out as if it were brand new, everything spins and seems as though it has plenty of torque. However it still is taking 2-3 times as long!!! the only thing I notice is 1) this problem is lessened (slightly) when I am in the fine expresso grind settings but anything above lets say 25-30 setting is 2- 3 times longer. 2) I am noticing vertical burr shaft play and am thinking that perhaps this is vertically oscillating increasing grind time? Ideas? Thx! Greg
Hi Greg,
Some users have mentioned tiny plastic nubs that poke out from beneath the stainless steel cladding. I am told those still wear down, but they are so small it is hard to conclude if they actually matter. It might be worth taking a close look at the impeller to see if there is anything noticeable at all.
Hi Ben-
Thanks for the awesome guide and 3D part! I was able to take apart and replace everything, but now I am getting a weird grinding sounds at finer grind settings. I cannot quite tell if it’s plastic or metal. My guess is metal-on-metal. I took out the top burr and there’s no noise, which also makes me thing that my re-assembly has somehow gotten the burrs to grind each other…
Here’s a video. Have you got any ideas on how to get this working properly? Do I need to sand down the impeller somewhere?
I am asking before messing with it more because re-assembling those long screws is a pain :) and required to test any adjustments I might make (other than sanding/filing from above).
LMK your thoughts!
Alan
Based on your video there must be a upper burr to lower burr clearance issue. That is definitely the sound of the burrs beginning to touch.
First check the lower burr height relative to the *lip on the drive shaft*. Inspect the picture here for reference to make sure your burr it is not sitting too high:
Störung an der BCG800XL Mühle wegen abgenutztem Flügelrad
Next, you can pretty easily just pull the lower burr (just take off the acorn nut and lift the burr). Make sure no grounds or anything got between the impeller and the lower burr. Also make sure at reassembly that the acorn nut is torqued pretty tight. A few flicks of the wrist tightening should get it there.
Once you are confident the lower burr is correct, and if the problem persists, then the problem must be with the upper burr height:
Störung an der BCG800XL Mühle wegen abgenutztem Flügelrad
Could the larger gear have gotten rotated out of alignment? It sets the upper burr height.
Thanks, Ben-
The lower burr was indeed being held up too high. I was able to sand out some of the area indicated in red in step 20 and that seems to have corrected the problem sufficiently. Not perfect but I am not taking that darn top off again, my 8” screwdriver won’t hold a magnetic charge and man that’s a giant pain.
I should note that when I was tweaking the height, I would put the large gear back on, upper burr, and top (without putting the LCD back in) so that I could test it with minimal re-assembly. That might be a good tweak to the instructions so folks can verify the grinding is working properly before re-assembly.
I also somehow managed to get one of the top screws lost into the coarseness knob! It will jiggle around in there for the rest of its life :)
Thanks again, saved my grinder for a few more years.
Alan
Ben-
Ok I’m a few months into the repair and realizing that we cannot get a fine-enough grind to actually make espresso. I actually recall this happening when we first got the grinder. I thought it was my bad barista skills, but now I am realizing that maybe the old worn-down impeller actually caused a 2nd grinding to occur as we had an incredible fine grind, so much so that often even with a light pack nothing came through the shot!
Does this sound familiar?
Do I need to remove those screws to get more fine grinding, or do I just need to sand down the impeller more so that the “fine” setting actually has the burrs closer together?
I’d appreciate your thoughts.
Thanks!
Alan
Unfortunately sanding on the impeller will only make the grind coarser. It will cause the lower burr to sit even lower, resulting in a larger gap with the upper burr. Two thoughts:
When you first started and the burrs were too close and even touching — could it have worn down the burrs?
I can’t stress enough that the lower burr and lip on the drive shaft is the best reference for knowing that the lower burr is the correct height. Usually sanding the impeller is not necessary and I am wondering if now that it has broken in the sanding took too much off.
Störung an der BCG800XL Mühle wegen abgenutztem Flügelrad
In any case the modification to support extra grind range is probably worth a shot. I have used if for two years now — nearly all espresso — and the only real caveat is to listen for the burrs touching so you never go to far.
Honestly I barely sanded the impeller. I am quite sure I didn’t grind the burrs destructively as I noticed the sound and immediately fixed it. I don’t think it ran more than 60-120 seconds total with the slightest metal noise. I see no evidence of any metal scraping on the burrs or the bottom flat edge of the upper burr. Like I said, this grinder didn’t grind very fine when we first got it and I think it has just been successfully restored to the original state that didn’t work well… gonna take apart now and see what I find.
Ok I was able to test the burr levels with it open. I used the mod of removing a screw to get it a bit finer. Here is a video of it running. I am curious if this sounds bad to you (aka is the finest mode here metal-on-metal grinding?) Or can it be used to grind safely in this configuration? I definitely don’t want metal in my beans…. Otherwise, maybe this unit is just slightly out of level or just messed up in some other way, Thoughts?
I can update that doing the coarseness mod (I only took out 1 screw) has restored the ability to grind fine enough to actually pull a good shot.
It works! Great step by step guide. But:
I replaced the impeller, fired it up and had a very LOUD screeching noise when dialed down to fine grind. It was a definitely metal to metal sound. After reading troubleshooting steps I thought maybe sanding the underside of the new impeller listed in Step 20 would do the trick.
Then I found Step 9 and realized I had not removed that old fibrous felt ring. I removed the ring, reassembled (again) and bingo! No screeching! It works perfectly and I am soo happy. :-) I figure that felt ring was holding the impeller and lower burr just high enough to contact the upper burr when dialed down to fine.
The only step of yours that did not match my grinder is Step 12, in the cut-away picture of Burr Evaluation. My grinder came with only 1 thin washer on the drive shaft. But even with just 1 thin washer, the height of the lower burr on the drive shaft, b4 tightening, is in-line with your measurements.
Thank You Ben!
Nice job Robco. Good to know some units only have one washer as well. Maybe at the factory Breville varies it based on tolerance stack up. In any event glad you got it all fixed up and enjoy your coffee.
Hi Ben, this looks like a great guide! I purchased my BCG800XL in 2014 and within a month the drive gear stripped. Fortunately it was still under warranty so I got a replacement and it has performed pretty flawlessly since then. Recently though, I’ve had a problem with it not automatically shutting off after a grind, or sometimes shutting off after only a second or two. It only happens intermittently though, so I suspect it is probably because the switch/sensor needs cleaning. But since you’ve been inside yours, I was wondering if you had any thoughts as to the cause? Thanks!
thank you so much.
the instructions were spot on
ordering the part was easy.
and it took me 15 minutes to disassemble/replace the impeller and to re-assemble.
ran a few test grinds to to see what size and amout was being delivered.
and it worked perfectly
Again, thanks
Congrats Stacy! Enjoy your coffee.
Thanks Ben, I followed along with the Youtube video with the kids watching. I have a few things I think I need to adjust. 1) I must have moved the dial before putting everything back together, so I can’t get the setting to move to very fine. I will open it up again and adjust when I have time. 2) The volume of grounds coming out seems to be a lot more than previous - even when it was new. I have it set to “1” and less grinds and it’s filling the portafilter. 3) I also have the overspray issue. I will try the cooking oil suggestion.
Thanks for writing. Problems #2 and #3 may all be due to the same issue of the burr spacing. When it runs too coarse it can grind a LOT more beans in the same amount of time. The finer you go the more the torrent of grounds becomes a trickle. I would first check the *lower burr* alignment and closely compare with the illustration here: Störung an der BCG800XL Mühle wegen abgenutztem Flügelrad
Only after that begin trying to adjust the *upper burr* adjustment gear. If the alignment got messed up it will take a bit of experimenting to get right again. As the big gear rotates it moves the upper burr carrier (gray cylinder) up and down. Störung an der BCG800XL Mühle wegen abgenutztem Flügelrad
Hi Ben,
I bought a Breville Grinder BCG800XL for parts thinking that the impeller was going to be the problem. Upon arrival it was clear that the gearbox was at fault, so I decided to try to repair it. I found two 3D models on the internet and decided to give it a try using Shapeways. I created one in nylon and the other in nylon with glass beads to test it out. Just want to say that I successfully fixed it using the 3D model yesterday and the machine is working superb! I had some issues with adjustment at the end, because I took the machine apart so many times that at the end the cogs ended up moving.
I'll try to update this comment in a few months regarding the durability of the part. If you want I have some pictures as well that might help some of the folks that are going thru that route of fixing the gear box.
Best,
Ben
I saw your video on replacing the impeller in a Breville bcg820bssxl whic,h I assume is similar to the one in your video. Unfortunately I tried cleaning the impeller before I saw your video on replacement.
I do have a question. I was able to remove the impeller without taking the whole machine apart from the reader. This seemed easier than what you did in the video. Did I make a mistake by doing it that way? I did not replace the impeller only cleaned all the packed coffee in the bottom. However when I put it back together, it didn’t work. I then watched your video and I believe the problem to be that the impeller tips are clearly warn down . Also right under the impeller. On your video I did not see that fiber bushing. Do I need it.
Is it possible that I could talk to you. I could call you at your convenience or you could call me. My email is rick@dullanty.net. Thank you
Hi Rick, Hmm, I only cover the BCG800XL and the BCG600SIL in the videos. The BCG820 is a newer design with internal changes to the impeller (steel cladding) and the drive shaft. The 3D printed replacement will not fit that model unfortunately. That said, with the 820 it is possible to remove the impeller without significant disassembly since it is smaller. It should not harm anything to take it out and put it back the way you did, and the lack of a felt ring is fine too. Regarding how to proceed: It may be possible to bend the steel fins on the BCG820 impeller, so that they protrude slightly further. This idea is untested, and I make no guarantees, however is an option to potentially try.
Hello Ben,
I have a problem that I think you didnt mention in your (great) post. I tried to remove top and lower burr and clean it, but it s still there. Would you have any idea of the steps to repair it?
Thank you,
Charles
Hi Charles, That unfortunately looks like a stripped main drive gear all the way inside the gearbox. Your grinder looks fairly new so you might call Breville to see if it’s still under warranty. Drive gears are unfortunately hard to come by. There is a source on ebay however it is way overpriced in my opinion. Another user above mentioned 3D printing one, however I am not sure what model he used and what the durability is.
Thank you Ben, I will call Breville. I just bought the grinder 2 weeks ago. Only thing is I took it to China and bought it in the US. Hopefully we’ll find a way to activate the warranty.
Thank you so much! Got the repeller today, in and out of the grinder in 15 min, and it works like a charm!
PS, I don’t get the comment that the directions were too hard to follow. In my mind, easier than putting together something from Ikea.
Great guide - would have been unlikely to have solved the problem myself, tho I had gone in far enuff to see the problem of impacted grind around the impeller / expeller chamber. I did order the part and it arrived as described after paying a little more than expected for a ore reasonable schedule of manufacturing per their schedule, shipping, tax, etc … but the end result after going through the steps carefully seems to have worked. Mine did have a small ring of a felt-like material around the base of the impeller post, beneath the impeller, which I left off on reassembly as it didn’t look like would fit in the new one (ring on bottom side). Grind adjustment initially looks to be OK - time will tell. Thanks for the write up - seriously good work!
Following up on the previous (Nov 11) … the machine worked fine for a few days, then caked in the expelling chamber and the exit chute appeared to be plugged as well. Reading thru the step 20 recommendations, I disassembled and sanded the red areas as suggested to adjust the alignment between impeller and the top of the post. It worked for about a week and is now apparently caked again as nothing is coming out — the grounds that did come out at the end being in very small, fine clumps. The beans are not oily or particularly dark. Disappointing. I can’t keep taking the thing apart just to clean out that chamber. Planning to open it up new and check the alignment with the top of the driveshaft - otherwise am stumped.
I fixed my machine with your part, but the grind settings got out of whack. Do you have any suggestions on how to fix that?
Wow, great guide, a genuinely excellent contribution to everyone. I can't imagine how many kgs of reduced waste in the world. So many people have a small issue like this and buy an entire new grinder, or even worse, an entire new duo set with coffee machine. I will 100% be fixing mine myself and I will enjoy it like it is a product made in the old days, just a little more ‘enhanced' :D
Excellent instructions Ben. My one problem is I have the BCG820 with the same problem. I’ve got as far as trying to remove the gear assembly but cannot get it off following your instructions . I’ve even tried reinstalling the removable burr basket and yanking straight up but nothing moves. Has anyone got it off? Any ideas?
I have also purchased you replacement impeller. How is the sizing different then the ”stainless steel clad improved” impeller? Looks so close in size that with a bit of filing or extra washers I could get my worthless grinder back into workable order.
Leave it to the engineers at Breville to get a complaint about their machine. Over engineer the problem part, add it to a new model and never fix the original problem.
Again, thank you for your wonderful instructions (best I’ve seen anywhere) and any help you can give me.
Paul
Hi Ben:
I recently performed your impeller fix on our Breville coffee grinder, and it worked exceedingly well. Thanks so much for all your efforts in developing this fix. Your procedure was very well documented, making the fix very easy to do. Shapeways was excellent in supplying the part required. I did choose to buy the part made out of the slightly more expensive plastic material in the hope that it may last a bit longer. Again kudos to you and any others that helped. The fix saved us money and also the environment by not having to throw away an otherwise good piece of equipment.
Hello Ben, I added my comment on the video comment section. The upper ring will not come off with my hardest tug. Do I smack it with a screw driver & hammer? Thanks, Ray.
Thanks so much guys. I replaced my impeller some years ago using this method after purchasing the 3D printed impeller. It is still working perfectly.
Cheers
Andrew Clarke
Sydney Australia
Hi Ben. Thank you so much for preparing this guide and designing and making a replacement impeller available. I HATE throwing away equipment due to unavailability of parts. My 8 year-old grinder is now working as good as new - not taking up space in a landfill.
Cheers,
Howard Weingarden
Ottawa, Ontario CANADA
Has anyone else experienced the problem of the impeller appearing to be *far* to tall? The impeller and lower burr assembly (with all the proper washers and split washer) fits exactly like it’s supposed to per step #12. However, when I try and snap the upper burr carriage assembly and gear ring back on, the bottom of the carriage (grey plastic piece) contacts the impeller blades and it won’t seat.
You will notice that this carriage is indexed and that it will only seat one way. For the carriage to seat I have to rotate it a full turn (360 deg) to raise it up enough for the assembly to snap on. This of course means that my ‘fine’ setting now grinds drip. Anyone else experience something similar?
Next step is to disassemble it again and measure new impeller height with stock. Stay tuned.
Hi there, I know you say that this is not for the BCG820XL. My grinder is a BCG820BSSXL (is that the same as the BCG820XL?) and it appears to be having this same issue with the impeller. I’ve tried communicating with Breville but the repair will cost $100 so I was thinking of purchasing the 3D printed impeller and trying my hand at this repair on my own. I got the grinder in 2018 and find it hard to believe that they expect us to spend 1/3 the cost of the unit every 2 years to keep it running.
Hi,
I’m interesting it purchasing the newer Breville Model #BCG820 that Williams-Sonoma currently sells. Therefore, I’ve been researching the historical design issues before I decide. You indicated that this model has a metal impeller which presumably has eliminated the premature wear issues of earlier models. Are there any other design issues that have surfaced with this current model?
Currently, I’m using a Nuova Simonelli Model MCF small espresso grinder which is built like a tank and has performed flawlessly for the last 12 years. Now, I want to buy another grinder for drip coffee, but don’t want to buy one that is going to fail in 2-3 years.
Gyle / alcbevs100@yahoo.com
Hi Ben, for the two options on Shapeways, are they both made of Nylon 12? Do you have any material spec sheet for this? I want to make my own decision regarding “food safe”. The “Contact the Designer” button is not working.
Thanks,
Mark
Do you have any solution for the BCG820? It appears that my impeller is also wearing out
Thanks for this guide. I did it! Albeit the lip on the driveshaft was not within the.05mm flush as you specified. it was more. I tried tighting the nut more but it was as tight as it would go. I figured it would be okay. Had everything back together and put the hopper in locked it plugged it in and all I keep getting is the message to lock it. I have tried reinstalling the hopper several times. Still can’t get the darn thing to lock. I am thinking this has something to do with not having the lip within the 0.5 mm. That is Problem 1, but now I have Problem 2:
I decided to start all over and can’t remove the burr/gear assembly as in getting it to unclip from the four clips underneath. I actually had to get help removing it on the first go-around and the helper isn’t here now so not sure if you have any tips on how to remove this. I think this is the hardest part of this job - way worse than that screw buried deep under the wires. Thank u for the guide. It is thorough and easy to follow. mary
Hi,
This morning I changed my impeller following all the steps and it seems to work perfectly. But when I did a 2 shots of grind coffee…two problems. First, the quantity of coffee was a lot more then 2 shots and it was coarse even with the adjustment at the finest. Seems like the space between the lower and the upper burr is too big.
Richard Lemieux
I have the same problem. I only have 1 washer under impellar as others have commented.
I have just ordered the impeller but I noticed I only have one washer for under it rather than two. Not sure where the other one went. Can I try to buy one the same size as the one I have at the hardware store? That is, are the 2 washers exactly the same?
I also only have one.
Grinder was jamming and then torque jumping. Bought the shape ways part. Installed it. Now works better than new. Thanks for the help.
Thank you for all the work on this. I purchased the 3D part, followed the directions, and now everything is working!
—Brian
BT.beerprojects.com
I have the same issue as @Patrick Newton. We did the shapeways fix and everything seemed fine. Then I switched to new beans and I got the same high pitched noise that sounds like nothing is in the grinder. Nothing comes out even after two or three times of running the grind setting. The hopper works fine. I pulled it and the beans pass through into a bowl. I’m just completely frustrated and ready to give up.
Thanks for the excellent article! Before I buy an impeller, how do I know if my motor is burned out? It doesn't try to grind at all, just makes a high pitched whirring sound
Hi Ben,
I have purchased a new impeller from you and installed it in my BCG800XL. When I took mine apart, the two thin washers that sit on top of the base pedestal were missing. Are they supposed to be in my model? And if so, do you know what size they are supposed to be so I can get them? Thank you.
Excellent instructions and information. I was able to complete this repair with only 2 trips to the hardware store (dang driver). Unfortunately, it did not fix the main issue I was hoping it would (albeit not addressed specifically here). The digital readout of my grind setting continually jumps around, even when not in use, which causes the machine to alternate between “shots” to “cups” constantly . I had hoped re-aligning the white gears might reset something there, but no luck. I have a better understanding of how it works, now, though, and it should extend the usefullness of this appliance a few more years.
Hi Ben, I tried this first with a $6 amazon part and then the one from Shapeways. In both cases, I couldn't get the grind fine enough. The $6 Amazon impeller was too thin. The Shapeways one didn't get the top of the lower burr within 0.5mm. My grinder only came with one shim washer - but hey, it worked fine for many years. I'm not sure what gives but the solution is... recalibrating.
To recalibrate, remove the two set screws on the burr assembly gear. Plug the grinder in and depress the funnel switch in the lid to activate the electronics and turn the rotary encoder until it is in the middle of the fine-coarse scale. Snap the burr assembly back into the machine and reattach the lower burr as per your instructions. Then, insert and lock the upper burr. Now, with the funnel switch pressed in (I used a toothpick), activate the grinder. Adjust the grind with the grind knob, going finer, until you notice the machine slowing down. This is because the burrs are rubbing. (See next comment.)
Once you notice the grinder slowing, quickly back off until the motor speed returns to normal. Turn the grind a tiny bit coarser than the point where the motor returns to normal. Now unplug and use a magic marker to mark the point (the gear valley) where the main gear meets the middle of the encoder gear. That's your new calibration. Remove the burr assembly and count 4 and 7 teeth to the left and mark each tooth. Get a small drill that is about the same size as the old limit screw holes and drill two holes at the dimples on those teeth, and reinsert the screws there. Now, plug the unit in and manually turn the encoder until the display shows "fine" and your mark on the encoder gear points to the main gear. Reassembly follows your instructions from there on. That is apparently what Breville does at the factory. I got perfect grounds after this recalibration.
new lease of life for my grinder, thanks!
Hi, my stainless steel grinder impeller is not pushing out the grinds either, just wondering if you have any ideas why?
J M - Antwort
It could be that the beans are just too dark for this grinder. See Step 21 for example. When roasts are ultra dark, they tend to make a paste that clogs everything and a lot of grinders cannot handle it. If that’s not it, the ShapeWays impeller does do a better job expelling grounds since the blades go all the way to the edge of the cylinder. In that case, you are more or less doing an upgrade rather than a repair. Changing beans is still probably easier.
Ben Gottemoller -
I have a BCG820. The impeller is NOT REAlly steel. It’s simply a kind of “armor” that just covers the top. It makes it LOOK like the impeller is steel, but it’s not. Underneath it is a very similar plastic impeller. Mine started giving me problems about a month or two ago.At around the two year mark from date of purchase.
I purchased one of the 3D printer impellers for the BCG800. I know someone already tried it on an 820, but I want to try myself and see how it fits. My grinder is not functional at all anymore because of the impeller. The burrs are in great shape, but it just doesn’t push out the coffee anymore. Some signs that this is happening to your grinder are that it starts to take it longer to grind the same amount of grams of coffee beans than before. It use to take my grinder around 18 seconds to graind 16 grams. Now it takes it close to 40 seconds. Also, if I put in 10 g of beans, I only get around 8.5 g of ground coffee.
adolfox - Antwort
Did the impeller fit on the 820?
If yes, did it fix the issue?
cpcp -
The new metal “impeller” (it’s actually an expeller as it blows the grinds out the side vent) is total bunk. It doesn’t reach the sides of the cavity nor does it go all the way to the bottom of the cavity. (The plastic insert under the metal keeps if about 3 mm from the bottom).
Dark oily beans may worsen the problem but that’s not the whole deal. I roast my own beans, light-medium roast (below second crack). I set the grinder to 3 clicks above absolute zero before I ever add any beans. This makes about a perfect espresso grind as I get a 25 to 30 second pull after packing to 30 to 35 lbs.
At this setting, by the second use, you can hear the motor struggling. (I believe they’ve also gotten some motors made with cheap copper windings and it’s now under powered.) That, along with the lousy impeller, this is not a grinder for anyone who wants to make espresso properly. After a few weeks to a year of use (I’ve gone through 3 Barista Express and a BCG820) the motor drive gears will strip and you’re done.
dsm6855467 - Antwort
Sounds like you know your stuff. Thanks for commenting. When I first heard the newer BCG820 had that redesigned metal clad impeller, I though Breville had finally fixed things up for everyone. It is really unfortunate they went through that redesign without making proper improvements. Just simply extending the blades to the edge of the cylinder reduces the torque on the motor, and reduces the friction that wears out the impeller. The average density of grounds in the chamber during grinding drops down because the impeller stays ahead of the game rather than getting backed up. That is probably the main reason the 3D printed design has done so well. My BCG800XL was warrantied back in 2013, I replaced the impeller with my 3D printed design in 2016, and is still going strong. I did have to tighten the torque limiter this year, but otherwise so far so good.
Ben Gottemoller -
Don't get too excited, the 820 still has a plastic impeller. It's just covered with stainless steel that doesn't really solve the problem. I had the old grinder and they sent me the new one under warranty bc of the old impeller. Same issue. And I clean this one regularly. It is nice that it's easier to disassemble and clean. You can actually remove the Burr easily. But still get clumping. So you make an impeller for the 820?
Stephen Brown - Antwort
In agreeance with Stephen, do not attempt this repair on the 820 unless you have a seperate custom made impeller. The 800’s will not work and after grinding it down with a dremel, it still jammed. Breville will not send you the part which frustrates me even further.
I’m going to work on a 3D printed one soon, but for the time being, don’t bother. Go buy a Sette.
Paul Dentel - Antwort
Thank you for your incredible amount of work to make MY life easier….and obviously SO many others regarding the Breville Smart Grinder. I have had theBCG800XL since about 2012 or 2013 and just about a month ago started getting that Rat-a-tat sound. Once I saw your review on YouTube and heard you explain the sound I was convinced I had the same problem. I have since ordered two of the impellers for my grinder. My next question is in regards to the same machine: Is there any source available for replacing the the burrs (upper and lower)? I haver purchased a used similar unit for a backup for replacement parts, if necessary and those burrs are TOAST! Scratch marks show obviously something like a rock got down that far and trashed the burrs. Any suggestions for replacement sources? Or is this another possibility for more 3D engineering? Please help by responding, thanks.
segue3@comcast.net - Antwort
Hello! Thank you for designing this part. I bought it and a week later, I received the part. It installed with no problems, and it works like a charm. The clearance around the shaft is very tight, so I had to press it down onto the shaft, but it fit perfectly. Now my Breville Grinder is better than ever, and I recommend this fix to anyone. Thanks so much for all the design work, instructions, and for making the part available.
Neal Patel - Antwort
I also have the bcg820 and on a recent bag of Starbucks oily French roast, it started to clack. I took it apart, but the black ring gear assembly would not release with reasonable force. So I left it in place, but could see coffee impacted around the impeller. In the days before the failure, coffee was coming out in compacted lumps instead of powder. As I understand it, the clacking sound is the clutch slipping to protect the motor, which is a good thing. For a plastic machine, this one seems solid. Anyway, I used compressed air and a wire (a zip tie would be ideal) to clean the coffee out of the outlet channel and around the impeller. I think it may have had some blockage even before the French roast, and then the oilier coffee began a death spiral. I reassembled it all and worked better than it had for some time. Take away: if you notice any clumping of coffee in your portafilter, stop and clean your machine's outlet chute and around the impeller. Run some white rice through the grinder to scour oils etc
John Gudmundson - Antwort